Need help with light setup.

LAXitives288

LAXitives288

Active Member
First of all, I would like to say you guys have a wealth of information here. I haven't been a member long but i've been lurking and reading more than I care to admit for the past couple weeks. I think i've got a pretty good handle on everything but I do have a question about a potential light set up. I'm also a first time grower but long time smoker, so i'm trying my best to keep everything simple and easy to manage/hard to fuck up catastrophically.


That being said, I havent actually built anything just yet for fear of doing something that was less than ideal. But I took drafting for 7 semesters in high school so I sketched some stuff up real fast to see if my plan/box would be able to do what I want it to and if it can't I want to make the changes before I've wasted any time or money because my budget is *slightly* tight. I have enough to do it right, but I don't think I have enough to do it wrong once and then fix my mistakes.


My basic plan right now is to make a box out of plywood and 2"x2"s. The box would have a 2 foot by 2 foot footprint and would be 3 feet tall. It would have an exhaust located up top and an intake on the bottom with hopefully some CPU fans doing the pushing and pulling but I could use something else that you guys think is easier/cheaper/better if those won't flow enough. I'll also have an oscillating fan in the ass well. I've decided for my first grow i'm definitely doing soil and more than likely doing 2-3 autoflowers at a time. I may change away from soil and probably away from autoflowers for subsequent grows. But from what i've read autoflowers are more resistant to rookie mistakes and I find that appealing. The quick at which the crop is ready is also a selling point for me.



For my light set up, i'm thinking of making an equilateral triangle with sides that are 6-10 inches long and mount a 42w CFL on each corner and one in the center of each triangle. I would do one for each plant and suspend them from the roof of the box with string or fishing line which would allow me to easily keep the lights a proper distance from the plants. I also plan to LST the little guys to hopefully increase yield.



I guess my biggest questions are.

1. Will 2-3 autoflowers fit in a box with a 2 foot by 2 foot footprint? If not, could I fit them in a 2'x3' footprint and make the box 2 feet tall instead of 3 feet?

2. Will 2-3 autoflowers net me at least a couple ounces of bud assuming I'm not a completely terrible gardener?

3. Will my light setup be sufficient? (4x42watt cfl's per plant) Basically 11,000 lumens per plant.

4. Whats a solid choice for an autoflower for a newb? I'm thinking something like a Low Ryder 2 or Sweet Seeds Fast Bud? Any recommendations?




Here's a basic diagram of what i'm planning on doing. If I wasn't clear or something doesn't make sense, please feel free to tell me and i'll do my best to clarify. Also, I realize this could possible go in the grow room setup subforum, but I feel like the CFL subforum was a better choice because its such a micro-grow and i'll be dealing strictly with CFL's.









Thanks for the help guys! Also, first post, whoop whoop!
 
R

rombomb420

Well-Known Member
LAXitives288 said:
First of all, I would like to say you guys have a wealth of information here. I haven't been a member long but i've been lurking and reading more than I care to admit for the past couple weeks. I think i've got a pretty good handle on everything but I do have a question about a potential light set up. I'm also a first time grower but long time smoker, so i'm trying my best to keep everything simple and easy to manage/hard to fuck up catastrophically.


That being said, I havent actually built anything just yet for fear of doing something that was less than ideal. But I took drafting for 7 semesters in high school so I sketched some stuff up real fast to see if my plan/box would be able to do what I want it to and if it can't I want to make the changes before I've wasted any time or money because my budget is *slightly* tight. I have enough to do it right, but I don't think I have enough to do it wrong once and then fix my mistakes.


My basic plan right now is to make a box out of plywood and 2"x2"s. The box would have a 2 foot by 2 foot footprint and would be 3 feet tall. It would have an exhaust located up top and an intake on the bottom with hopefully some CPU fans doing the pushing and pulling but I could use something else that you guys think is easier/cheaper/better if those won't flow enough. I'll also have an oscillating fan in the ass well. I've decided for my first grow i'm definitely doing soil and more than likely doing 2-3 autoflowers at a time. I may change away from soil and probably away from autoflowers for subsequent grows. But from what i've read autoflowers are more resistant to rookie mistakes and I find that appealing. The quick at which the crop is ready is also a selling point for me.



For my light set up, i'm thinking of making an equilateral triangle with sides that are 6-10 inches long and mount a 42w CFL on each corner and one in the center of each triangle. I would do one for each plant and suspend them from the roof of the box with string or fishing line which would allow me to easily keep the lights a proper distance from the plants. I also plan to LST the little guys to hopefully increase yield.



I guess my biggest questions are.

1. Will 2-3 autoflowers fit in a box with a 2 foot by 2 foot footprint? If not, could I fit them in a 2'x3' footprint and make the box 2 feet tall instead of 3 feet?

2. Will 2-3 autoflowers net me at least a couple ounces of bud assuming I'm not a completely terrible gardener?

3. Will my light setup be sufficient? (4x42watt cfl's per plant) Basically 11,000 lumens per plant.

4. Whats a solid choice for an autoflower for a newb? I'm thinking something like a Low Ryder 2 or Sweet Seeds Fast Bud? Any recommendations?




Here's a basic diagram of what i'm planning on doing. If I wasn't clear or something doesn't make sense, please feel free to tell me and i'll do my best to clarify. Also, I realize this could possible go in the grow room setup subforum, but I feel like the CFL subforum was a better choice because its such a micro-grow and i'll be dealing strictly with CFL's.









Thanks for the help guys! Also, first post, whoop whoop!
Click to expand...
This is just based on stuff I've read & picked up on RIU, I've never actually grown low ryders but I was looking into it for a few weeks.

1.) I think you really need at least 1 square foot per plant if you put them in 5 gallon buckets, which is recommended. Your box would have to be around 3x3x2 for 3 plants, unless you put them in smaller pots, which gives you a smaller yield. :)

2.) Ya hopefully more if you are gonna use that much light & still manage to keep temps reasonable. Let's just say 2+ oz's

3.) Yes!

4.) Can't really help you there as I haven't actually grown any of them. You don't have to do autos/lowryders though. You could just go 60 days from seed on a 12/12 lighting cycle with bagseed or any seedbank strain. For autos use a constant 20/4.

Keep in mind that many lights in that small of a space you will have some heat issues. You need at least 50 watts per square foot, but going over either 100 or 200 watts per sq ft?? is over kill. Anyone care to clarify on that feel free. I'm still trying to learn. & Welcome to RIU! + Rep for doing drafting. A lot of us could use some of that. lol
 
SunnyJim

SunnyJim

Well-Known Member
I agree with Rombomb.

You'll need at least 1 sq foot per plant. The lighting you plan to use is more than sufficient, and as long as you can control the heat in your box, the more light you can use the better. What spectrum are the bulbs? If you have the funds, I would suggest you use 6400K bulbs for veg, and swap them with 2700K for flowering.

I think it's dangerous to start guessing what your yield might be. Every grow environment is different, every strain is different. In short, there are too many variables to contend with when trying to guess your yield. I made that mistake early on in my grow, too. The truth is, you'll yield what you yield. The first grow is always a massive learning experience, and you'll no doubt increase your yields with every new grow. I wanted around 3 dry ounces from my 2 plants, but that only leads to frustration and disappointment if you fail to achieve it. The strain I'm growing is really slow to flower (my ladies are currently asleep between days 35 and 36 of flowering), so the more I stared at them, the more I thought I'd be disappointed with my yield. That said, I've learned loads so far, and I haven't even finished my first grow. I already know things to change next time which will increase yield, things I didn't know 2-3 months ago, just by watching them grow. Luckily, my girls' buds have really started to fatten up over the last few days. I'm stoked with how they're looking. Even now I couldn't guess what my yield will be, and I'm about 3 weeks from harvest. Anywhere between 1 - 3 ounces, probably. Although 3 ounces would really surprise me...

I'm not too sure about auto strains, either. I was all set to buy some Easy Ryder fem'd seeds, but the guy in the seed shop told me I'd be disappointed with the results. A forgiving Indica is what he recommended, with some LST to keep them short(ish). Can I ask why you're thinking about autos? Is it due to space restrictions, or the quick turnaround, or something else entirely?

Awesome diagram, btw. If you put this much effort into your grow consistently, I'm sure you'll have great results.

Peace
 
LAXitives288

LAXitives288

Active Member
rombomb420 said:
This is just based on stuff I've read & picked up on RIU, I've never actually grown low ryders but I was looking into it for a few weeks.

1.) I think you really need at least 1 square foot per plant if you put them in 5 gallon buckets, which is recommended. Your box would have to be around 3x3x2 for 3 plants, unless you put them in smaller pots, which gives you a smaller yield. :)

2.) Ya hopefully more if you are gonna use that much light & still manage to keep temps reasonable. Let's just say 2+ oz's

3.) Yes!

4.) Can't really help you there as I haven't actually grown any of them. You don't have to do autos/lowryders though. You could just go 60 days from seed on a 12/12 lighting cycle with bagseed or any seedbank strain. For autos use a constant 20/4.

Keep in mind that many lights in that small of a space you will have some heat issues. You need at least 50 watts per square foot, but going over either 100 or 200 watts per sq ft?? is over kill. Anyone care to clarify on that feel free. I'm still trying to learn. & Welcome to RIU! + Rep for doing drafting. A lot of us could use some of that. lol
Click to expand...


First of all, thank you for the input.

1. They really need 5 gallons of soil? I was under the impression that 1 gallon would be plenty, but its very possible I was wrong.

2. I can very easily do 3x42 watts per plant or do 4/3 lower wattage bulbs per plant. I really dont want to constantly fight heat but if it means significantly more buds, I'll gladly spend a little extra to benefit cooling.

3. I guess my follow up to that is, how much light is overkill? At some point the plants can't use any more light and you're just creating extra heat for you to evacuate, this is something I would like to avoid. Is 50watts of CFL per square foot ideal? Or should I have slightly more than that? It would be even easier to just do 2x42w CFLs per plant and it would be cheaper and make it easier to fight the heat.

4. I know I don't HAVE to do autoflowers, but right now, it seems pretty appealing. None of the weed I buy ever has seeds in it so bagseed could be hard to come by and then I have to deal with sexing and all that, which I know isnt very complicated but it'll be nice to know what I have from the get go and not have to worry about it.


And thanks for the drafting rep, what I put up wasn't good by any means, it was just me thinking out loud mostly. If I was serious, I wouldve used more than a pen and a scale hahaha.
 
R

rombomb420

Well-Known Member
LAXitives288 said:
First of all, thank you for the input.

1. They really need 5 gallons of soil? I was under the impression that 1 gallon would be plenty, but its very possible I was wrong.

2. I can very easily do 3x42 watts per plant or do 4/3 lower wattage bulbs per plant. I really dont want to constantly fight heat but if it means significantly more buds, I'll gladly spend a little extra to benefit cooling.

3. I guess my follow up to that is, how much light is overkill? At some point the plants can't use any more light and you're just creating extra heat for you to evacuate, this is something I would like to avoid. Is 50watts of CFL per square foot ideal? Or should I have slightly more than that? It would be even easier to just do 2x42w CFLs per plant and it would be cheaper and make it easier to fight the heat.

4. I know I don't HAVE to do autoflowers, but right now, it seems pretty appealing. None of the weed I buy ever has seeds in it so bagseed could be hard to come by and then I have to deal with sexing and all that, which I know isnt very complicated but it'll be nice to know what I have from the get go and not have to worry about it.


And thanks for the drafting rep, what I put up wasn't good by any means, it was just me thinking out loud mostly. If I was serious, I wouldve used more than a pen and a scale hahaha.
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Yes I understand, I don't think that drawing would have gotten you an A in class. lol I agree too that autos are interesting which is why I wanted to do it but I also had some decent seeds so I just figured I'd wait instead of taking the risk ordering from a seed bank. I would say if you really wanted to reduce heat in your box you could cut a piece of plexiglass to fit under the lights but over the plants & keep a separate intake & exhaust for the lights at the top. Drill a couple holes in the glass to run string thru to raise & lower it & voila. Heat shield.

I know you can go over 50 watts per square foot, but I can't remember if it's at 100 or 200 watts per sq foot where it becomes redundant & the plant can't absorb anymore & then you are just adding heat stress. You need to strike a happy medium. I think 2x42 watts/sq ft is realistic as it's pretty close to 100 watts/sq ft.

As far as the soil goes, I think it directly effects your yield, to a greater or lesser degree, depending on the strain. Autos seem to have large root structures for being a smaller plant above ground. Honestly if you want bud quick just go with a 60 day 12/12 grow with any seed strain, then you aren't limited to the auto choices. Do you prefer indica or sativa? Couch lock or uppy energetic high? That should determine what you choose more than autoflowering traits. Just my .02.
 
R

rombomb420

Well-Known Member
SunnyJim said:
I agree with Rombomb.

You'll need at least 1 sq foot per plant. The lighting you plan to use is more than sufficient, and as long as you can control the heat in your box, the more light you can use the better. What spectrum are the bulbs? If you have the funds, I would suggest you use 6400K bulbs for veg, and swap them with 2700K for flowering.
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+ rep to sunnyjim for agreeing with rombomb! lol

He's right tho, you want the higher spectrum cfl's for veg & the lower spectrum for flower. Muy importante!
 
LAXitives288

LAXitives288

Active Member
My drawings were always bad because i'm artistically retarded. I started to shine once we started using computers. You should see the plans I did for a mini ramp I made, they were rad as fuck!


I honestly prefer a more uppy high because I like to smoke and go longboarding/shortboarding but I find that the method that I smoke the weed with has a greater effect on my high than what i'm smoking. I kind of want to stick with indicas just because they tend to stay shorter and fatter. For the price i'm paying to do this project, I really dont mind what high I get as long as it gets me high. I completely convinced I want to buy feminized seeds though just because I'd hate to only do 2 plants and have one or both of them be male.


Whats the deal on doing a 12/12 light cycle the whole time? Do the plants then decide when they start flowering instead of the grower deciding by changing the light cycle?



I'm aware of the need to switch the light spectrums for vegging vs flowering. My only question is, I see some people using 2x2700k's and 2x6500k's for flowering, is there any upside to having them mixed besides saving a little money or is completely 2700k light best for flowering?
 
SunnyJim

SunnyJim

Well-Known Member
LAXitives288 said:
My drawings were always bad because i'm artistically retarded. I started to shine once we started using computers. You should see the plans I did for a mini ramp I made, they were rad as fuck!

I honestly prefer a more uppy high because I like to smoke and go longboarding/shortboarding but I find that the method that I smoke the weed with has a greater effect on my high than what i'm smoking. I kind of want to stick with indicas just because they tend to stay shorter and fatter. For the price i'm paying to do this project, I really dont mind what high I get as long as it gets me high. I completely convinced I want to buy feminized seeds though just because I'd hate to only do 2 plants and have one or both of them be male.


Whats the deal on doing a 12/12 light cycle the whole time? Do the plants then decide when they start flowering instead of the grower deciding by changing the light cycle?

I'm aware of the need to switch the light spectrums for vegging vs flowering. My only question is, I see some people using 2x2700k's and 2x6500k's for flowering, is there any upside to having them mixed besides saving a little money or is completely 2700k light best for flowering?
Click to expand...
As far as I'm aware, autos will flower irrespective of the light cycle. Although I've read that some prefer 18/6, others 24/0. My advice would be to read up of the auto strain you decide to go for, and find out what light cycle works best for it. But like Rombomb said, you can put a regular strain on a constant 12/12, and it will flower. I've seen people do that with the first cuttings of a mother to determine it's sex, but they're usually tossed after the sex is confirmed because they're so small. From what I've read, a constant 12/12 eliminates veg, so your plant will look different. It won't be bushy, and you'll probably end up with one main cola, similar to an auto.

I guess people might use a combination of both spectrums with autos because plants require both at some stage during the grow. Although plants can veg under red, they respond better to blue/white. And although plants can flower under blue, you'll achieve better results with red. If I were growing autos or doing a 12/12 from start, I would probably start the grow with blue and wait until the first signs of flower. If I was happy with the size of the plant at that point, I would switch all the bulbs to red to help develop bigger and denser buds. If the plant was still small, I would probably leave a couple blues in to help veg the plant a little more.

I completely agree about going down the fem'd seed route. I'm way too impatient to spend 2 months vegging a couple plants, only to find out they're males and start the whole thing again. I got 5 fem'd seeds, germed two, and neither has hermied on me so far. Both are sexyful ladies. Obviously the best option is to keep a mother in constant veg and take clones, but you can't really do that with autos.

Let us know what you decide, dude.
 
LAXitives288

LAXitives288

Active Member
I think i'm just gonna do the auto route because I'm going to be buying seeds anyway. It'll also make growing slightly easier because I wont have to worry about light leaks or anything near as much because complete darkness i'snt as crucial and I get the super short growing cycle and can still maintain decent yields.


I guess it looks like 2x42w lights for each plant unless someone convinces me more or less light would be better.


Is 36 inches tall enough though? Even if I wanted to grow some regular(non-auto) plants later? Realistically i'll only have 30 inches of space because the lights will hang down some and then the pots i'm growing in have some height also, so realistically, the limit for how tall my plants can be is about 24."

If I go taller than 3' i'll need more plywood which means buying a second sheet, so then I just might as well go wider too because i'll have extra plywood and then I might as well just grow more. But then why bother making a box, just use a whole room........ Hahaha, growing is an addiction isn't it?




Unrelated question. Do you guys ever sell some of the weed you grow with micro-grows or do you keep it all yourself? I feel like i'll end up growing more than I can smoke, which isnt bad, I can share with friends etc etc. But the idea of a little extra cash for my efforts seems nice but I really don't want to get into selling drugs because that just adds a new wrinkle where you can get in trouble/caught.

If i'm being too newbish let me know, I've been using the search a lot and finding my answers but I havent really looked for this yet.
 
SunnyJim

SunnyJim

Well-Known Member
If you can, I would throw an extra 42W on each plant. Just make sure you have enough cooling. Anything over 90 F, and you'll stress your plants.

I only have about 2 ft of grow height, so LST is the way to go. Not only does it help with height restrictions, but with CFL growing (poor canopy penetration), it helps expose more of the plant to light. If you do try regular strains, I highly recommend LST. You should be fine with 3 ft. I might scrog my next grow, which is a technique you can use if height is a serious issue.

Unrelated answer: I haven't harvested yet, so I can't comment on whether I grow more than I smoke. I doubt it, though lol. I go through a little under an ounce a month. If I were harvest 2 ounces per month average, I certainly wouldn't sell it. That's a whole other game I don't want to get involved in. I would probably share the surplus with friends, tell them to supply the beer if I supply the bud, but that's as far as it would go for me. I'd much rather show them what I've learned, and tell them to invest a small amount of money into their own grow.
 
LAXitives288

LAXitives288

Active Member
Thats what I feel like, I was just curious because the little devil on my shoulder suggested it.



I was definitely planning on lst, most for the increased yield because those auto grows dont get that tall. 6 bulbs at a time shouldnt be too hard to keep cool, i'm used to doing heatshields on cars so i'll figure out how to shield plants too.




If that doesnt make sense its because im :eyesmoke:
 
SunnyJim

SunnyJim

Well-Known Member
Yeah, he speaks to me too. The good thing is I would need to build a completely new setup to turn this operation commercial. He can yell as much as he wants, the only way I'll do significant surgery on my current setup is if I yield less than an ounce total from these two plants.

I'm not sure you'll need to go to the trouble of making heat shields, just enough intake and exhaust. Generally you need twice as much exhaust as intake. My bulbs are only hot to touch, so the plants can be within half an inch of them without getting burnt.
 
LAXitives288

LAXitives288

Active Member
A couple new wrinkles. I bought some weed about a week ago, it wasnt that great but the price was right. Anyways, I found 5 seeds in there, so i've been thinking, for the first grow, do a couple weeks of vegging and then go to flower or even 12/12 from seed, I havent decided. Even though the weed the seeds came from was about average quality, I figure it will be a good way to start because the seeds were "free" and I already have them. I also found it funny that I found seeds in my weed for the first time 3 in years when i'm only about 1 month from starting my grow.


Another thing, I found 2 23w cfl's and one 42w cfl in the garage at my parents house and they all work. I read all the literature on the base of the bulb but it didnt give me a light spectrum but when theyre lit up they are all very warm colored so i'm going to assume that theyre 2700k. My question is, would it be acceptable to veg with 2700k lights for a couple weeks or should I even bother? I could always do 12/12 from seed, i'm just not sure what would be best.


Any help is very much appreciated.
 
stumpjumper

stumpjumper

Well-Known Member
5 gallons of soil??? Not hardly unless you are growing a 12' tall plant under a 1000w sodium/halide mix.. lmao...
 
HistoryPuff

HistoryPuff

Active Member
LAXitives288 said:
Another thing, I found 2 23w cfl's and one 42w cfl in the garage at my parents house and they all work. I read all the literature on the base of the bulb but it didnt give me a light spectrum but when theyre lit up they are all very warm colored so i'm going to assume that theyre 2700k. My question is, would it be acceptable to veg with 2700k lights for a couple weeks or should I even bother? I could always do 12/12 from seed, i'm just not sure what would be best.


Any help is very much appreciated.
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You can include 2700k lights but it's common for most people to do only 6500k for veg, or a 2-1 ratio, so make sure you have more 6500k bulbs. Also, about the bagseed, you should keep in mind that since they have seeds in em then they were grown alongside males, but if you get rid of the males when you grow them, there will be a higher thc content since the plants won't be putting it's energy towards seeds. So with that in mind just decide if you want weed quickly, or a bunch of good quality weed a month or two afterwards. I'm going to do an autoflower soon and I can't wait! Gonna try out LST also, seems like something everybody should be doing! haha Peace
 
LAXitives288

LAXitives288

Active Member
An extra 42w for my original plan or for the 2x23w and 1x42w that I found? I was planning on getting at least a few more 23w's in addition to what I found, I was just stoked to find some cfl's and bagseed within a week of each other "for free"
 
MrJones86

MrJones86

Active Member
If the 2700k is all you've got, then it will work. It won't grow as well as if you had the 6500k's, but it will grow.
 
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