run, rend pawl, run!

NoDrama

Well-Known Member
what do you think interest rates are like on this side of the pond nowadays?
Well lets see, the average price of a 2 bedroom in the boulder area is $265,000. I assume you got a good loan at around 4% APR over 30 years. The total amount you will pay is approx $460,000 which is 2 HUNDRED THOUSAND dollars in interest you dummy.

I know math is a bitch for you and all, but you think you could be right even just once.

So how come your wife didn't take out a small portion of her massive wealth and just pay for the house out of pocket and save that couple a hundred grand??
 

SmokeyDan

Well-Known Member
Buck, I shall teach you know the rule of 72.

At 1% interest, a principal amount will double in 72 years.

At 2% it will take 36 years.

At 4% it will double in 18 years.

You get the idea?

If in the first 5 years of your note you put $100 extra with each payment and applied it to the principal, you'd save tens of thousands in interest.
 

UncleBuck

Well-Known Member
Well lets see, the average price of a 2 bedroom in the boulder area is $265,000. I assume you got a good loan at around 4% APR over 30 years. The total amount you will pay is approx $460,000 which is 2 HUNDRED THOUSAND dollars in interest you dummy.

I know math is a bitch for you and all, but you think you could be right even just once.

So how come your wife didn't take out a small portion of her massive wealth and just pay for the house out of pocket and save that couple a hundred grand??
40% tax to cash in stock to do that.

and 200k on a 265 loan is still not 2-2.5 times, as harrekin claimed.

we still haven't done the inspection on this place, it's in an hour. all i really care about is the electric, rest of the house looks fine.
 

SmokeyDan

Well-Known Member
If you add 200ish k to a 200ish k loan you are paying 2x when you pay interest.

I think the original wording of that statement was confusing also.

Your not paying 2x in interest alone, but by the time you're adding interest in its around 2x what you finance.
 

Harrekin

Well-Known Member
40% tax to cash in stock to do that.

and 200k on a 265 loan is still not 2-2.5 times, as harrekin claimed.

we still haven't done the inspection on this place, it's in an hour. all i really care about is the electric, rest of the house looks fine.
I posted the exact amount it would cost in interest on the last page, you dumb schmuck.
 

NoDrama

Well-Known Member
40% tax to cash in stock to do that.

and 200k on a 265 loan is still not 2-2.5 times, as harrekin claimed.

we still haven't done the inspection on this place, it's in an hour. all i really care about is the electric, rest of the house looks fine.
40% tax? You mean to tell me that your wife bought all of her stock THIS YEAR? You told me she has had stock for years and years and years now, which mean you either lied to me, or you have no fucking clue how taxes on the selling of stocks works. Which is it?
 

heckler73

Well-Known Member
$265k @ 4% with monthly payments of $1265.15 will wind up costing $190454.19 in interest over 30 years.
Great formula for calculating periodic payments (P),



where L=loan amount, i=decimal rate of interest (A.P.R.), n=number of periods p.a. , & t = years of term.

That gives me an idea for plotting it in Maple...thanks for the inadvertent inspiration!
 

UncleBuck

Well-Known Member
$265k @ 4% with monthly payments of $1265.15 will wind up costing $190454.19 in interest over 30 years.
Great formula for calculating periodic payments (P),



where L=loan amount, i=decimal rate of interest (A.P.R.), n=number of periods p.a. , & t = years of term.

That gives me an idea for plotting it in Maple...thanks for the inadvertent inspiration!
loan is much less and payments are a bit higher. and we are going to make payments greater than required since we can easily afford to.

we pay 1800 in rent now and our mortgage is hundreds less.
 

londonfog

Well-Known Member
loan is much less and payments are a bit higher. and we are going to make payments greater than required since we can easily afford to.

we pay 1800 in rent now and our mortgage is hundreds less.
that the smart way to do it...if possible
 

UncleBuck

Well-Known Member
40% tax? You mean to tell me that your wife bought all of her stock THIS YEAR? You told me she has had stock for years and years and years now, which mean you either lied to me, or you have no fucking clue how taxes on the selling of stocks works. Which is it?
i propose an alternate explanation: you are an idiot.
 

heckler73

Well-Known Member
loan is much less and payments are a bit higher. and we are going to make payments greater than required since we can easily afford to.

we pay 1800 in rent now and our mortgage is hundreds less.

That's exactly what I'm trying to do a 3d plot of. What rate of interest are you looking at on that mortgage and what term length?
 

UncleBuck

Well-Known Member
That's exactly what I'm trying to do a 3d plot of. What rate of interest are you looking at on that mortgage and what term length?
30 year loan at 4.125%. gonna be knocking out an extra $300 or so a month (or more) so we can refinance after a couple years and drop the mortgage insurance, which we do not need but which is required by law.

it was cheaper for us to pay the mortgage insurance for a few years than to pay the 40% tax on selling enough stock to get the down payment to 20%.
 

heckler73

Well-Known Member
30 year loan at 4.125%. gonna be knocking out an extra $300 or so a month (or more) so we can refinance after a couple years and drop the mortgage insurance, which we do not need but which is required by law.

it was cheaper for us to pay the mortgage insurance for a few years than to pay the 40% tax on selling enough stock to get the down payment to 20%.
That's what insurance ideally is for. To offset a cost--via leverage--one would otherwise bear.
Anyway, here's a plot of a $230k loan @4.125% 30 yr term, showing what will happen if one pays anywhere from $0 - $1500 per month. As you'll see, $1500/mth knocks that mortgage out in ~18years (too lazy to calculate it or use a pointer function in Maple).

230k mortgage 30yr at 4.125.png
 

Harrekin

Well-Known Member
loan is much less and payments are a bit higher. and we are going to make payments greater than required since we can easily afford to.

we pay 1800 in rent now and our mortgage is hundreds less.
Did you check if it was a fixed rate or variable?

If its variable. did you check what the conditions/frequency they can increase it?

Normally Im intentionally a dick to you, but this is something I wouldn't like anyone to fuck up.
 

UncleBuck

Well-Known Member
Did you check if it was a fixed rate or variable?

If its variable. did you check what the conditions/frequency they can increase it?

Normally Im intentionally a dick to you, but this is something I wouldn't like anyone to fuck up.
i would sooner slam my dick in the car door than sign a variable rate mortgage.
 

heckler73

Well-Known Member
Did you check if it was a fixed rate or variable?

If its variable. did you check what the conditions/frequency they can increase it?

Normally Im intentionally a dick to you, but this is something I wouldn't like anyone to fuck up.
Variable is nasty...if interest rates were Volckered, those people get fucked. But even fixed rates have renewal periods (5yrs around this part of Kuhnuhduh). I also seem to recall the American mortgage system getting an overhaul post-GFC.

I also realized Buck is getting some service charges and/or taxes lumped into the monthly payments, by the sounds of it. I wonder if those are fixed or are they compounding those, too ?!?
 

UncleBuck

Well-Known Member
Variable is nasty...if interest rates were Volckered, those people get fucked. But even fixed rates have renewal periods (5yrs around this part of Kuhnuhduh). I also seem to recall the American mortgage system getting an overhaul post-GFC.

I also realized Buck is getting some service charges and/or taxes lumped into the monthly payments, by the sounds of it. I wonder if those are fixed or are they compounding those, too ?!?
the mortgage insurance payments are fixed and we can get rid of them once we pay off 20% of principle. if we're lazy on payments and i don't build a greenhouse and stay inside, that'll take 4 years. if the greenhouse is up next spring and we just pay what we're paying now (aside from the GH income), it'll take a year or so.
 

heckler73

Well-Known Member
the mortgage insurance payments are fixed and we can get rid of them once we pay off 20% of principle. if we're lazy on payments and i don't build a greenhouse and stay inside, that'll take 4 years. if the greenhouse is up next spring and we just pay what we're paying now, it'll take a year or so.
Ahhh... it sounds like it is a fixed monthly fee based on principle paid, correct? If so, how much is it? Is it also percentage based or a generic fee (e.g. $19.95)?
I can add that part into my model above and get a more realistic "map" of what it all really costs. I don't know if it's any use to you, but it gives me an opportunity to muck around with empirical data and keep my modelling skills sharpened.
 
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