That's the prob w/conservatism; it's complicated.

ccodiane · Oct 21, 2008

john.roberts85 said:
So let me get this straight. Conservatism is so "complicated" that it can be summed up in a podcast? Lol. Burke must be rolling over in his grave. Why don't you read Burke then Paine's Rights of Man, and tell me who you side with.

Don't take my word for it.

100.3 KTLK-FM, 100.3 K-TALK Minneapolis/St. Paul

john.roberts85 · Oct 21, 2008

ccodiane said:
Don't take my word for it.

100.3 KTLK-FM, 100.3 K-TALK Minneapolis/St. Paul

I've read Burke and Hooker. I don't need a talk show host to sum it up for me; I've read the original sources. Thanks though. :peace:

ccodiane · Oct 21, 2008

john.roberts85 said:
I've read Burke and Hooker. I don't need a talk show host to sum it up for me; I've read the original sources. Thanks though.

Pretty lame.

john.roberts85 · Oct 21, 2008

ccodiane said:
Pretty lame.

Yup, books are lame.

ccodiane · Oct 21, 2008

john.roberts85 said:
Yup, books are lame.

No, I meant; "I don't need to listen to smart people to learn. I've read Payne, I've read Burke, I've read Hooker. Conservatism is static and I know everything about it that there is to know. Thanks anyways though. :peace:

"

ViRedd · Oct 21, 2008

Interesting how veterans ... liberal veterans that is, discount conservative folks who have never been in the military as though their opinions aren't valid. A good way to cut off debate, I guess. Cuts it off, but doesn't win it.

Vi

ccodiane · Oct 21, 2008

100.3 KTLK-FM, 100.3 K-TALK Minneapolis/St. Paul

I don't always agree with this guy. He's an isolationist at heart, I've inferred, and with this especially, I strongly disagree. He's damn smart, though, and articulates conservative principles beautifully, succinctly, and in a entertaining fashion.

I apologize for coming across in a confrontational tone (John Roberts!) as all those reads are excellent reads, but, others here would do well to listen to some Lewis, as it has done me well :blsmoke:

. So, don't knock it till you try it....or do, and expect some flack from me, the guy promoting Lewis.

john.roberts85 · Oct 21, 2008

ccodiane said:
No, I meant; "I don't need to listen to smart people to learn. I've read Payne, I've read Burke, I've read Hooker. Conservatism is static and I know everything about it that there is to know. Thanks anyways though. "

If you think he's smart that's fine, it certainly doesn't make it true. Honestly, I don't want to listen to any political talk radio of any sort. The people I know who do usually come up with lame statements like: "Liberalism is simple. __________ is the enemy. Unite around Democrats. ____________ is evil. Obama is good." It's Paine, not Payne.

john.roberts85 · Oct 21, 2008

ViRedd said:
Interesting how veterans ... liberal veterans that is, discount conservative folks who have never been in the military as though their opinions aren't valid. A good way to cut off debate, I guess. Cuts it off, but doesn't win it.

Vi

Liberal veterans like McCain who said: "There's a clear division between those who have a military background and experience in these issues and people like Giuliani, Romney and Thompson who don't -- who chose to do other things when this nation was fighting its wars."

ccodiane · Oct 21, 2008

Let's try this again......

john.roberts85 said:
So let me get this straight. Conservatism is so "complicated" that it can be summed up in a podcast? Lol. Burke must be rolling over in his grave. Why don't you read Burke then Paine's Rights of Man, and tell me who you side with.

You're right. Thanks! ("Paine". Thanks!)

TheBrutalTruth · Oct 21, 2008

john.roberts85 said:
Liberal veterans like McCain who said: "There's a clear division between those who have a military background and experience in these issues and people like Giuliani, Romney and Thompson who don't -- who chose to do other things when this nation was fighting its wars."

Yeah, that'd be the Liberal Veteran we're talking about, lol.

ccodiane · Oct 21, 2008

john.roberts85 said:
If you think he's smart that's fine, it certainly doesn't make it true. Honestly, I don't want to listen to any political talk radio of any sort. The people I know who do usually come up with lame statements like: "Liberalism is simple. __________ is the enemy. Unite around Democrats. ____________ is evil. Obama is good." It's Paine, not Payne.

I've read a few of your posts. Are you a conservative? Or are you independent?

ccodiane · Oct 21, 2008

john.roberts85 said:
Liberal veterans like McCain who said: "There's a clear division between those who have a military background and experience in these issues and people like Giuliani, Romney and Thompson who don't -- who chose to do other things when this nation was fighting its wars."

Can you argue against it? I'm sure you can, but, he's clearly right. (I don't think the the snide attack at the end was necessary, although, he's right again.) Hence Biden.

john.roberts85 · Oct 21, 2008

ccodiane said:
I've read a few of your posts. Are you a conservative? Or are you independent?

I guess I'd say I'm more of a transformative democratic socialist, which is misleading in a way due to the fact I'm not a socialist. My views are similar with Paine, Mill, and Attlee (sort of). I'm also a fan of Thaler and Sunstein and their development of libertarian paternalism.

TheBrutalTruth · Oct 21, 2008

john.roberts85 said:
I guess I'd say I'm more of a transformative democratic socialist, which is misleading in a way due to the fact I'm not a socialist. My views are similar with Paine, Mill, and Attlee (sort of). I'm also a fan of Thaler and Sunstein and their development of libertarian paternalism.

So... what exactly are your beliefs, because frankly, I'm not sure what a transformative democratic is, and I'm only familiar with Paine (Age of Reason).

john.roberts85 · Oct 21, 2008

TheBrutalTruth said:
So... what exactly are your beliefs, because frankly, I'm not sure what a transformative democratic is, and I'm only familiar with Paine (Age of Reason).

I believe the gov't has a role in correcting market failures and promoting social justice. That's it pretty much.

TheBrutalTruth · Oct 21, 2008

john.roberts85 said:
I believe the gov't has a role in correcting market failures and promoting social justice. That's it pretty much.

How do you defend against the charge that the biggest market failures have been a result of government interference?

john.roberts85 · Oct 21, 2008

TheBrutalTruth said:
How do you defend against the charge that the biggest market failures have been a result of government interference?

I don't because government failures are non-market failures. :mrgreen:

TheBrutalTruth · Oct 21, 2008

john.roberts85 said:
I don't because government failures are non-market failures.

Smart ass answer, but it doesn't explain these erhm, "affordable" houses that McCain and Obama want to engage in price fixing to stabilize.

john.roberts85 · Oct 21, 2008

TheBrutalTruth said:
Smart ass answer, but it doesn't explain these erhm, "affordable" houses that McCain and Obama want to engage in price fixing to stabilize.

Thought you'd like it. Don't really feel like I have to explain positions I don't support, but I do support vouchers like HUD's.

That's the prob w/conservatism; it's complicated.

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