Total Hydroponic Control (T.H.C.) - The build starts NOW!

T.H.C. Temp Screen. There will be two temp screens, second to be posted shortly. Temperature screens include settings for the A/C and exhaust fans. When they are turned on the temperature setpoint determines whether or not they run. An emergency temp shutdown setting will allow the user to shut the entire system down if temperatures go beyond the emergency setpoint. Second page includes the deadband, and cycle times for the a/c and fans.

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Agree with diyer using dosing pumps not a good idea because you will never know what your low on only thing your controller will know is what your sensors are telling it need more nutes need more ph down wait need more ph up wait need more nutes etc you will be chasing a ghost. Drain to waste is the best for 100 percent growth perfect every time when you top off your res. Bottom line You may will never know exactly what the plant is using more of in the nute solution.
 
That is what reservoir changes are for. Anyone who runs a recirculating system uses reservoir changes... It's nothing new to growers. Recirculating systems have proven themselves time and time again. Anyone running a recirculating system is aiming for a Target EC and running a nutrient schedule. The nutrient dosing ratio maintains window Target npk ratios, and the weekly, or bimonthly reservoir change takes care of any imbalance caused by variation in nutrient uptake. When your running drain to waste, you may know exactly what the npk ratio is of your nutes but that doesn't mean the plant is using that exact ratio anyway. Both methods require some forgiveness on the plants part.
 
Deadband will handle any searching on the part of a controller. Example: PH deadband will be set for .2 PH. If the setpoint is 5.8 that means the controller will PH adjust to 5.8 and then wait until the current value falls outside a .2 PH window before is tries to correct it. Drift is normal with PH and EC.. that is why deadband is so important, so your not constantly adjusting up and down.
 
DIYer said:
Hey man, nice bunch of expensive looking toys you got there :-P I'm all about automation, i always say i would rather man the machine then be it.

I'm most interested in the peristaltic pumps to dose nutrients into the reservoir, or more so how you intend to rig that up? I recently started a DIY to gravity dose my res, went with a liquid level controller and some solenoids only, whole thing cost me around $130 and i'm about done with it, here. How do you plan to have adjustability in the amount you dose? I couldn't figure out a convenient way with pumps, so i went with syringes in my build.
subbed.


:peace:
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You can get peristaltic pumps that put out at minimum 0.1mL/sec (+- 0.05mL) and 1mL/sec maximum, that should be more than enough control to dose a reservoir over 1L. At 10L that will give you 10ppm resolution.
 
I wish I had the money to purchase a standalone HMI and all the transmitters. I have a SLC504 (16ID, 16IA, 16OD, 16OA) setup sitting boxed up in a closet somewhere from when I was in college, I intend to use it for something someday, lol.

That said, I am doing something similar, but I am having to build everything myself to cut costs and will be using a microcontroller (AVR or PIC, haven't decided) or maybe something like the Raspberry Pi running linux, or both!

The way I have designed my setup is similar to yours, except my grow is a perpetual soil-less SoG, clone to flower. So I will have 6 separate containers (5 for flower, 1 for mother) that need to be independently monitored for pH, EC/TDS, and temperature, as well as 4 peristaltic pumps (pH up, pH down, Nutes, fresh water) per container. Then all the atmospheric monitoring and control, oi vey!

That said, you can get the peristaltic pumps off of eBay dirt cheap, that is including the head pump, a dc motor, and a mounting bracket. The ones I'm getting pH and nutes will be $20 each and have a dosing rate between 0.1mL/sec and 1mL/sec (+- 0.05mL), and since I will only be using 1 bottle of nutes, simply measuring EC/TDS will be enough for determining ppm.
 
Atarijedi said:
I wish I had the money to purchase a standalone HMI and all the transmitters. I have a SLC504 (16ID, 16IA, 16OD, 16OA) setup sitting boxed up in a closet somewhere from when I was in college, I intend to use it for something someday, lol.

That said, I am doing something similar, but I am having to build everything myself to cut costs and will be using a microcontroller (AVR or PIC, haven't decided) or maybe something like the Raspberry Pi running linux, or both!

The way I have designed my setup is similar to yours, except my grow is a perpetual soil-less SoG, clone to flower. So I will have 6 separate containers (5 for flower, 1 for mother) that need to be independently monitored for pH, EC/TDS, and temperature, as well as 4 peristaltic pumps (pH up, pH down, Nutes, fresh water) per container. Then all the atmospheric monitoring and control, oi vey!

That said, you can get the peristaltic pumps off of eBay dirt cheap, that is including the head pump, a dc motor, and a mounting bracket. The ones I'm getting pH and nutes will be $20 each and have a dosing rate between 0.1mL/sec and 1mL/sec (+- 0.05mL), and since I will only be using 1 bottle of nutes, simply measuring EC/TDS will be enough for determining ppm.
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I'm most comfortable programming ladder logic with Allen Bradley hardware. Unfortunately Allen Bradley is quite expensive. That is why I chose to build the entire system off of Automation Direct hardware. It is much more reasonable.

My employer is a fortune 500 company, and all new hardware coming into the facility is Allen Bradley. An Allen Bradley HMI can cost up to 6 grand.

While AB does have an incredibly attractive, and user friendly product, I can't justify those costs for a project like this.

If I was designing a system for a collective, or a dispensary where the initial investment would be offset almost immediately, then Allen Bradley could easily be justified.

An update on this system...


I know its been quite a while, but my primary job carries responsibilities that come first.

The logic for the PLC is 90% complete. The HMI screens have been completed and include 26 such user input screens.

The enclosures cutouts have been made, and this project is moving on to the assembly stage. All electrical prints have been completed.

Here is a picture of this weekend, debugging the system with a transmitter simulator.

DSC_0409.jpg
 
in10ceguy said:
Anyone used these transmitters?
View attachment 2197122
You may find them here
http://webpages.charter.net/tdsmeter/products.html
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I'm not a big fan of 0-5V signals for an environment where you could be battling electrical noise from digital ballasts. If this manufacturer could provide a 4-20mA option I would be much more interested. 0-5v can be stable, and the 0-10v range is a widely utilized industrial standard due to the ease of measurement (you can check the signal without breaking the circuit), but this project is centered around noise control, and 0-5v can't carry a signal with the same range, and noise immunity that 4-20mA can.
 
Alarms have been set up, all alarm points including PH, EC, TEMP, HUMIDITY, and CO2 are capable of sending an email to warn the user that a parameter has ventured outside user setpoints.

I've also finished setting up the remote ip features. Users with the proper login information will be able to remotely control the entire process from a computer, iphone, or ipad. Currently android is unsupported, but hopefully that will change soon.

If anyone is brave enough to help me test it, please throw me a pm and I will furnish you with the ip address and required login information... you can then romp around the screens and leave any feedback you might have afterwards. Experienced growers who know which features make their lives easier could be of great significance for debugging.
 
Hey guys. You should check out this product: www.robomatic.com . They are a new company that launched at the San Francisco 2012 Indoor Gardening expo. they have a networked capable EC/PH/TDS sensor. Two of them.. With microSD card logging and webserver. Basicly what you are trying to do.. They are a lot cheaper than building your own. Especially time invested at under $1000 for a three peristaltic pump system.

check it out

www.robomatic.com
 
edlikestoboogie said:
Hey guys. You should check out this product: www.robomatic.com . They are a new company that launched at the San Francisco 2012 Indoor Gardening expo. they have a networked capable EC/PH/TDS sensor. Two of them.. With microSD card logging and webserver. Basicly what you are trying to do.. They are a lot cheaper than building your own. Especially time invested at under $1000 for a three peristaltic pump system.

check it out

www.robomatic.com
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Cheaper? Not likely. It isn't overly complicated to do all that. I could probably build it myself for less than $100. Probes not included.
 
My "real" job has been incredibly tasking for the last several months. I've been busy working on several large servo applications. But this project was where my heart was. NO MORE EXCUSES.

During this last week this project has really raced towards maturity. All sensors have been calibrated, and the functions of the controller have all been tested. Heres an overview.


First screen. System Overview, all environmental variables can be viewed from this screen. From here various other screens control the real world outputs to achieve the set points of your environment. The controller sends email and text messages regarding parameters that have crawled outside user dictated settings.
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This is the PH and EC transmitter.
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PH and EC probes. Very rugged. Non submersible. These probes will be inserted in wells. The EC probe will NEVER need to be replaced. The PH probe will last up to two years.
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Here is an example of a lighting screen. This screen shows output conditions along with allowing the light cycle to be adjusted and start time to be entered.
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Another lighting screen. This screen include the hot restart protection timer. The HPS or MH will not be allowed to restart after an off condition until the user settable time has elapsed. It also includes a bypass feature for the hot restart timer, along with a manual over ride.
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Every parameter, including ph, ec, temp, humidity, and co2 level are trend graphed. The controller displays up to a hundred hours of logged data, and by simply plugging in a compact flash card into the HMI it will store any amount of data you could desire. This means you can go back at any time during the grow and view the conditions that resulted in either a fantastic harvest, or a sub par harvest.
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Exhaust, circulation, and air conditioning screen. Also includes a safety temp feature. This is a user settable temp at which all field devices are shut down do to a severe over temperature.
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Here is one of two main enclosures, this enclosure handles all the switching of high loads, also present is the power line filter, and 24 volt power supply which provides control power to much of the unit. You can see on the swing up door the receptacles which are front facing. Field devices like the HPS ballast, pumps, fans, and other controlled devices plug into this distribution panel, and then the power flow to them is controlled by the lower set of relays pictured. These relays are driven by the plc in the "control" cabinet.
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This is where the PLC, or CPU resides, along with the HMI, this cabinet is devoted to processing and displaying signals.
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The next and final phase of this controller build will be the high precision dosing system. These are high speed output cards which will feed a pulse train to 4 stepper motors controlling sub-mililiter accuracy dosing pumps. These pumps are capable of generating a vacuum for lift applications, and can dose into a pressurized line with incredible repeatability. After the dosing module is complete this unit will be headed out to a lucky grower for a nearly hands free test run. The system should be fully capable of creating a stress free, low maintenance, zero hassle hydroponic environment for any number of lucky ladies.
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I love the idea of a completely automated system. I find myself worrying about keeping things tweeked all the time. However I think the end reward feels better when you know it was YOUR accomplishment. However, a flawless system that puts money into your hands with little to no effort feels pretty good too ;-)
 
I would never recommend complete automation to someone learning to grow. This system will show its real benefits when dialing in a room to the exact needs of a given strain. Sometimes it's hard to ensure a perfect environment when away from the garden even for just a day. This system will ensure that the environmental and nutritional parameters your striving to achieve are maintained 24/7. It cannot not take a poor grower and turn them into a master, but it can greatly reduce time spent maintaining a garden so that a great gardener can focus on other pursuits. Imagine the goals you could set for yourself if ph, temp, humidity, conductivity, and co2 concentration fall to "behind the scenes" . You can then systematically observe how simple, controlled changes to the environment realistically affect the end yield and quality.
 
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