True HP Aero For 2011

Trichy Bastard said:

Hey dickhead (it's funny to call someone that when i'm not pissed at them)... I think you are leaping before you look bro. Stop buying stuff, start reading. While we're here for a support system, we can't answer each question you have right now because you don't even have a clue what you are doing or talking about (yet)... You have to understand the concepts, and what you want your build to be like-then you will know why you might want a PRV and how many solenoids you want. You cannot simply retrofit the "impulse buy" of a system you just got to be a HP-aero and expect to get the same results. All of the components must be thought out to work with each other. eg: So you have a certain chamber size/design? It dictates how you will best tackle the other variables. I'm sorry if you bought that rig based on seeing someone wrote about it here in my thread- had you read more before you bought, you would have learned that advice was from someone still trying to grasp the concepts. The machine will likely grow decent plants, so it's not a total loss, but don't expect it do or be what we're writing about in this thread, nor can you easily add a couple parts and make it work the same. If you want to get that thing up and running- I recommend checking out some traditional aero threads and asking some questions there- then read all the HP-aero threads (lots of work/knowledge) and then you can start designing a hp-aero system from scratch and put it together once you've gotten your money's worth and experience out of the system you already have. Don't worry- the system you have will likely grow nice plants-but it's different than what's in this thread...

Click to expand...

I put the name dickkhead as a joke lol but according to my girl sometimes Ian a dickhead HA! Thanks for your input he sold me a lp aero.sytem and advertised as a HP so I was panicking trying to fig out what else I needed cause he dissapeared. But all this info on hear makes me wanto to go in that direction. Your right Ian going to use what I have and get my money back then reinvest into HP aero.

Right on dickkhead, like your attitude- I am really sorry the guy took your money and didn't sell you what he advertised. That's bullshit. Did you order with a credit card? You can definitely dispute it and get th cash back if so... What you paid for that is around what I've paid for my HPA setup- but I could have made it alot cheaper to be honest. I think a simpler hpa can be made for $600 bucks or so it would seem, especially if you build the chamber from scratch like the styrofoam idea Atomizer told me about. Anyway, look forward to seeing how you get along with this system- keep us updated

DH: heheheh. I buy my mist heads, tubing, fittings, etc from Reptile Basics. IMHO, the mist head assemblies are essential to make minor aiming adjustments inside the pod. Plus, they're super simple to place. As to being a grow noob, the biggest learning curve is the ability to look at your plants and know something is wrong before it becomes a catastrophe.

FYI: Now that I solved the wilting/dying plant issue, yesterday I moved 5 plants into my HPA pod- 3 clones and 2 plants that were not getting enough light in my F&D rig, due to one F &D plant now being >36" tall and ~ 18" diameter that was literally blocking the light, preventing these plants from growing. The 3 clones are from her, plus, I have 8 more of her clones in my DIY bubbler. Today I added a second twin head mister to assure coverage to the far corners of my 33G Rubbermaid pod.

Hopefully, I will finally be able to show everyone what HPA sans accum can do. If for no other reason then to confirm why you all take it to the level you do.

Someone said they used a NFT rig prior to the switch. FYI you can use it to clone, or to grow small root plants (herbs, lettuce...)

foresakenlion said:

Firstly you were going to be harsher than he was r0m? Good to know bro.

Click to expand...

Yes, this isn't a secret society it's a forum for sharing information. I think telling someone they are to stupid to understand and/or learn this is not in the spirit I would like to see on this thread. You have ~100 posts here how many of them are asking for information or clarification? Take a look at TB's reply to the same question and you'll see a much more appropriate response.

foresakenlion said:

Secondly Aerojunkie, I don't need to defend myself to you, so I won't,

Click to expand...

Then you do......

foresakenlion said:

but what I will do is tell you he was PMing me over and over asking the simplest and most basic questions about growing. Things that would exist in a quality book on the subject, or on multiple free tutorials on the internet, I'd be happy to direct him to the same resources I found to be quality, but that isn't what he was asking for, he was asking for his hand to be held.

Click to expand...

He may be getting ahead of himself but that's not a reason to dismiss him.

foresakenlion said:

Dickhead I'm surprised you even commented? All I did was after having answered one of your PM's I didn't have to in the first place, with information that would help you, was to ignore the rest of them.

Click to expand...

I seem to recall getting PM's from you asking for help, why is it he isn't allowed to do the same? If you don't want to respond to his PM's don't.

foresakenlion said:

And I really only did that because I was diagramming my own system for hours... not that it's your or their business, but I was tired since you care so much, I'm happy to help I just feel like he needs more guidance than I have time for.

Click to expand...

You're written communication skills poor yet the people on this forum have taken the time to try and understand what you are saying and help when they can but you don't have the time to do the same with someone new?

foresakenlion said:

It's arrogant of me to suggest to someone that is completely new to try easier, more reliable and proven systems, that have proven yield metrics and calculations available?

Click to expand...

Your tone was offensive.

foresakenlion said:

He doesn't even know what equipment he needs, and you think that him hooking up a system under high pressure that could potentially kill him is a bright idea?

May I suggest you are not valuing his life, and I perhaps am.

Click to expand...

So you were born knowing all this and are just asking questions to make us feel good about ourselves?
That's a straw dog, doing anything can kill you and so can doing nothing. This is no more dangerous than a hot water heater or an under-counter RO system.

foresakenlion said:

Besides what would he do with that system right now? He doesn't from what I could grasp seem to understand pH, nutrients, lighting, etc, etc, he'd just kill his crop faster, or he'd get lucky and fluke into something wonderful.

Click to expand...

Again you were born knowing all of this?

foresakenlion said:

Yes, if trying to help someone not fail and potentially kill themselves in the process while wasting money on a system that without the correct understanding will be broken within months from equipment failure.

Click to expand...

Helping then to not fail by discouraging them isn't what I call helping, helping is trying to inform them and letting them make their own decisions.

foresakenlion said:

I think you and r0m if he had harsh words intended for me, are WAY OFF BASE.

I'm not arguing with you, you help him I'm not taking responsibility if anything goes awry at this stage in his development.

Click to expand...

So not answering his questions is somehow better than trying to give him the information he needs to avert a poor outcome?

foresakenlion said:

TB I meant if your fog, be it natural or artificial even if it consists of the smaller droplets, in the right density could support a full size plant. There are simply not enough droplets projects from any of the available ultrasonic equipment, sans one of those industrial ones we mentioned previously that is extremely loud and runs at 10000 RPM

Click to expand...

Again you're written communication skills are poor but others on this thread try to help you.......

Trichy Bastard said:

Here's a great writeup on different pipe thread types... As you'll see, BSP is only interchangeable with NPT in 1/2" and 3/4". I dont't believe I said BSP was on the Accumulator, its an american company, and bsp= BRITISH STANDARD PIPE. Why not use a T instead- it will do the same thing albeit at a different angle.

Click to expand...

Link???
The thread angle and form are both different in BPT and NPT. 1/2" and 3/4" do have the same TPI in both standards so you may be able to thread a BSP onto a NPT and get it to work but it would probably be a one shot deal because you would deform the threads of one or both of the parts.

Ok points well taken- so far this is healthy and I hope the issue is aired. But I beg please not to have any quibbling in this thread ( I specifically asked for it in post #1). All the aero threads get muffed up and I'd like this to not be one of them ending like the rest. Let's share information on aero here and if you wanna talk social skills- do it in some other forum. There is already too much random talk here about stuff that flies flat in the face of the knowledge I consider important to this method, and it comes from people thinking they know, but according to the way I understand things, -it is misinformation. I don't want it constantly permeating the thread because if someone tries to read in the future, they will get mixed up. I may end up being wrong, but this thread is to discuss a method that I consider the right way, if people don't agree, they can post their different ways in their own thread. Of course I don't want to stifle constructive thought process, but certain people bring up alot of random theories that don't even sound correct to me. And the whole point of this thread is to seperate itself from the countless threads filled with misinfo out there. Please try to post factual information, based on yourm own experiences, otherwise make sure you add in the statement "I heard somewhere" rather than accepting as fact something someone else wrote, that's how the growing community gets filled with so many incerdible rumors and folk tales. Let's consider this the "mythbuster's thread for aero"- lol...

r0m30 said:

Link???
The thread angle and form are both different in BPT and NPT. 1/2" and 3/4" do have the same TPI in both standards so you may be able to thread a BSP onto a NPT and get it to work but it would probably be a one shot deal because you would deform the threads of one or both of the parts.

Click to expand...

Oops! here's the link http://pirate4x4.com/tech/billavista/Plumbing/NPT[1].pdf

I hate when that happens! Yes r0m, you seem to know what I was eluding to...

While I'm tying up a storm- what's everyone's take on netpots? 2" will fit better in my setup than 3", but are they too small? I'll remind that I am oudoors, in year round 12/12 so they probably won't veg for long... I figure if they just hold the stem from falling down in the chamber that's the main purpose. And the smaller pots will give that much less rockwoll chunks the roots have to work through before they hit the open mist. I guess the smaller the better as long as the stalk never outgrows the diameter of the pot? What' d'ya think?

wow Trichy Bastard this is some good stuff havnt read threw it all yet but i will lol gona take me awhile to read threw this lol and i agree with you dude this is about HPA not bitchin bout weither some guy can do this he wants to learn just like the rest of us. but yeah really good thread Trichy Bastard

JACQO said:

wow Trichy Bastard this is some good stuff havnt read threw it all yet but i will lol gona take me awhile to read threw this lol and i agree with you dude this is about HPA not bitchin bout weither some guy can do this he wants to learn just like the rest of us. but yeah really good thread Trichy Bastard

Click to expand...

Thanks man- is that some kali mist in your pic- it's really nice! Be careful, hpa tends to suck you in and you'll obsess over it- lol...

lol na its black jack from satavia seeds 1 of my fav smokes ever spec that lemon pheno hmmmmmm. i do want to try that cali mist thou. but yeah man gona take me bout 2months to read this lol dyslexic an hate readin but this is what iv been searchin for for awhile now. but yeah good luck with your set up bro

sorry about the BS me an FORS squished it W.E it was. and thanks for understanding that im new and am eager to learn this method after seeing TF results! looking forward to that set up TB

dickkhead said:

sorry about the BS me an FORS squished it W.E it was. and thanks for understanding that im new and am eager to learn this method after seeing TF results! looking forward to that set up TB

Click to expand...

Whew! Glad about that. I just read this entire thread, having been lured here by r0m30. Just as I was getting to the very end, some new guys show up and then there's flame war. I was worried this very thread would end just as I arrived, as have basically all the previous aero threads.

I've read Treefarmer's and Cavadge's and all the stuff where Fatman, TF and Atomizer all had it out. I was devastated when I got to the end of Cavadge's thread and it was dead. . . Such a loss!

But enough of that, I'm here because I started reading this thread and I recognized that Trichy Bastard, r0m30, Mike Young, Hammer21, and even the venerable Atomizer and many others are all here, keeping the aero dream alive. There are actually people discussing aero here who know what they are talking about. What a find for me. . . Now I know why r0m hangs out here.

Anyway TB, I appreciate all the effort you've put in here, and I can't wait to see your system finally go into action. As I read through the thread, I realize I have a million suggestions alongside a million questions. As far as suggestions, I've learned not to offer ones not of my own personal experience but I have a few aero successes under my belt. I agree with everybody here that pics of finished aero grows are surprisingly rare. . . So if you'd like I'll be happy to share the details and results of my rigs.

I've seen you be encouraging to others about that before, but I didn't want to step on your toes since your brand-new latest and greatest labor of love is about to come out. I might be a little annoyed if some dude was showing off his finished rig on my thread right when I wanted the attention focused on what I had coming out. . . But then again you might not have the grow-ego I'm cursed with, Heh heh.

Anyway I'll be happy to post some pics of what I've been able to do with aero if you don't mind, but be warned, I have hundreds of pics and lots to say about it! Well, glad you're keeping this thread up and I appreciate its value as a place to hold together all the info we've been able to find about aero. Good work, great thread!

My 8 bucket system, 16 red 120o Tefens running at 60 psi, 2 seconds on, 2 minutes off, 30 days into flower.

Hey Mech. Welcome

Welcome Mech! I have read most of your thread (at least from the point you went to aero). I told r0m to extend an invitation, and I know he wanted you to see this thread as well. I don't have much ego at all, so please show off and inspire us all- that first pic was quite nice! I know your a very crafty person, so you would be a welcome addition whenever you chose to post. I would love to hear all of the things you've learned along the way, so I hope to hear more from you soon!

Much love guys! Much Love...

Flamewar? I don't call me not rendering aid a flamewar.

Anyway... back to something that matters... they have NPTF to BSPM adapters in stainless steel, not like anyone cares.

TB I'll model out your connection on the diagram too, who knows who can get what parts.... yeah out.

"While the actual specified outside diameters of American National Pipe differ slightly from those of British Standard Pipe, either thread may reliably be cut onto a pipe of its respective trade size. BSPT and BSPP threads are analogous to NPT and NPS threads, respectively.

WARNING: Never, never try to mate a BSP fitting with an NPT or NPS fitting if the pressure holding capability is at all critical."

http://pipeandhose.com/node/2

Ok, so scrap that, sans the adapter, wouldn't be safe under pressure. Adapter it's then.

Ok, here's what I've been doing since the last update...

These are the bulkheads as installed in the sidewalls for each mister. Obviusly had to consider the odd shapes on the interior of the paneling, I wanted to seat the bulkhead to the interior wall, but since they were so weird, I just made the interior wall hole larger, and fastened the bulkheads to the exterior walls.



As much as I wanted to avoid spray foam, it was most suited for filling in the large spaces around the bulkheads. I didn't want water to condense in the walls, or roots to creep into them.



I cut out a top door to view the roots (and hopefully lots of root-porn for you guys) as well as to be able to perform maintenance on the nozzles if the need ever arises. I considered the valleys and cut along them which worked out well. Used some weather stripping to seal out light and the moisture in, and it stops the door from falling in. Put on a handle.




Bypassed the pump's onboard pressure switch by taking out the wire. I will use the external one I bought as it is adjustable over a wider range of pressures, and I hear the ones that come with the pumps don't hold up for very long.


Here's how I tackled the accumulator hookup with the pvc 3/4x1/2 flange, then a 1/2 NPT to 1/2 JG tube and finally a 1/2 JG to 1/4 JG adaptor.


I was really excited that this is the perfect insulated reservoir, it just barely cleared the lid of the container I'll be keeping it in, and amazingly when I took off the spout a JG bulkhead fit perfectly into it! I also put one in the lid as well for the return when I purge my accumulator and any release from the pressure relief valve. Is it any irony that it is also made by rubbermaid? I think not. I bet they secretly make stuff for growers on purpose, and it constitutes a fair portion of their sales...



Here it is in th bin, with the filter along side of it...



And here's the preliminary workup of my control center. Everything plumbing and electrical is in here including the 12v deep cycle battery and charger. I will take some more detailed closeups when I am finished with it...


Well, what do you guys think so far?

Hey buddy, I am gonna miss you, can't rep you back

foresakenlion said:

Flamewar? I don't call me not rendering aid a flamewar.

Anyway... back to something that matters... they have NPTF to BSPM adapters in stainless steel, not like anyone cares.

TB I'll model out your connection on the diagram too, who knows who can get what parts.... yeah out.

"While the actual specified outside diameters of American National Pipe differ slightly from those of British Standard Pipe, either thread may reliably be cut onto a pipe of its respective trade size. BSPT and BSPP threads are analogous to NPT and NPS threads, respectively.

WARNING: Never, never try to mate a BSP fitting with an NPT or NPS fitting if the pressure holding capability is at all critical."

http://pipeandhose.com/node/2

Ok, so scrap that, sans the adapter, wouldn't be safe under pressure. Adapter it's then.

Click to expand...

Why are you still hung up on BSP? Were not in england and neither is Amtrol , and I believe you bought the same tank as me- here it says it's a 3/4 NPT(f) -which is what it is.
Is that the only BSP concern, or was there something else you were using?