What does it mean to be an atheist?

Nutes and Nugs

Nutes and Nugs

Well-Known Member
kpmarine said:
If it works for you, and you don't feel inclined to enforce it upon others; I will be the last man to fight it. Your particular spiritual preference doesn't make a bit of sense to me, but it does to you; and that's cool if you don't claim it as universal.
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My point in a way.
I don't go pushing what i believe in on anyone though,
I try to explain some basics to certain people that seem have open minds.
They can take it for what its worth.
I'm not telling anyone they are right or wrong.
 
BarnBuster

BarnBuster

Virtually Unknown Member
“But you must not make the mistake of supposing that absolute peace of mind is obtainable only through some form of religious belief: no, on the contrary I have found that as perfect a peace is to be found in absolute unbelief.”
MarkTwain in a letter to Charles W. Stoddard, 6/1/1885
 
Mechanical

Mechanical

Well-Known Member
kpmarine said:
It seems to me that "atheist" is a very hubristic term. To declare "There is no God." seems to overstep the boundaries of our knowledge; on par with saying "I know the one true path to heaven." I see how one can be an atheist in a particular sense (i.e. toward the Christian God), but I don't see how someone can universally claim there is no God. If you claim that no God exists; you are as bad as someone who claims to know the one way to heaven.

I would be classified as an agnostic; seeing as I cannot verify the existence, or lack, of a God. Maybe I'm missing something here, but I don' see how one can say whether or not there is a God at this point. Anyone care to clarify the atheist position? Maybe I'm just taking more directly than it is meant to be taken.
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As an atheist I think the question of whether or not there is a god is just as ridiculous as questioning whether or not there is an invisible tea cup orbiting the Earth. Am I 100% sure on either account? No but with your logic you can't rule out that there isn't a tea cup. Does that make sense? To me agnostics are fence sitters and that isn't meant in a derogatory way. Just means that they feel it is an important question one way or another and worth weighting the facts. I have a question for you as an agnostic person. Religious people usually have a book to tell them the story of their god and their creation. As an agnostic you can't really believe in any of their stories so why would you question whether or not their is a god? I guess what I'm asking is what is your foundation for even wondering if there is a god?
 
MrStickyScissors

MrStickyScissors

Well-Known Member
Mechanical said:
As an atheist I think the question of whether or not there is a god is just as ridiculous as questioning whether or not there is an invisible tea cup orbiting the Earth. Am I 100% sure on either account? No but with your logic you can't rule out that there isn't a tea cup. Does that make sense? To me agnostics are fence sitters and that isn't meant in a derogatory way. Just means that they feel it is an important question one way or another and worth weighting the facts. I have a question for you as an agnostic person. Religious people usually have a book to tell them the story of their god and their creation. As an agnostic you can't really believe in any of their stories so why would you question whether or not their is a god? I guess what I'm asking is what is your foundation for even wondering if there is a god?
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fear .
 
kpmarine

kpmarine

Well-Known Member
Mechanical said:
As an atheist I think the question of whether or not there is a god is just as ridiculous as questioning whether or not there is an invisible tea cup orbiting the Earth. Am I 100% sure on either account? No but with your logic you can't rule out that there isn't a tea cup. Does that make sense? To me agnostics are fence sitters and that isn't meant in a derogatory way. Just means that they feel it is an important question one way or another and worth weighting the facts. I have a question for you as an agnostic person. Religious people usually have a book to tell them the story of their god and their creation. As an agnostic you can't really believe in any of their stories so why would you question whether or not their is a god? I guess what I'm asking is what is your foundation for even wondering if there is a god?
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That's my problem with atheism: it requires intent and an anthropomorphic God. That teacup (Even the analogy references something man-made.) is only ridiculous to you because it gets related to a dogmatic god. To me, it seems a bit odd to make positive statements, in a universal way, about what can reasonably only be a subjective concept. For me, a spiritual concept of god cannot be universal, only subjective. I cannot say there is or isn't a god definitively, and the only truths on the matter can be subjective; that's my foundation, more or less. It seems all chances of spiritualism are tainted by the Christian god, if you're an atheist. That's why I'm an agnostic; I can't make a definitive call until something particularly compelling happens either way. In a way, I suppose it's a bit ridiculous that this has come to be such a big deal. Religion has been so forced into our society that we have no choice but to 'pick a side'.
 
Moldy

Moldy

Well-Known Member
People fucked up the god thing for me. Never trust someone that has to get forgiven once a week.

I've never met a religious person that ain't trying to change my life or someone elses.
 
*BUDS

*BUDS

Well-Known Member
Tell me something Wonka, do you believe that the earth is only 30,000 years old? Also why are religious people so whacky?
 
mudminer

mudminer

Active Member
GOD HERE said:
Why is there a need for a "god". It wouldn't even cross your mind if it wasn't such a huge part of the culture. At its most basic level, the universe is math, guided by laws of physics and such. It's more of a acknowledgement that the probability of there being a god with divine power is negligible. That's not to say that there may not be life out there somewhere in this mind blowingly gigantic universe of ours that to us would resemble divinity. But ask yourself, have you ever seen evidence of something divine? Something you know to exist outside the laws of reality, but still have an effect on it? It's kind of an oxymoron.
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wouldnt that depend largely on WHAT one considers to be part of their personal reality? i guess im trying to say that we all allow/disallow things to be REAL to us as individuals. im sure that there are things that i consider real to me that you pad or kp may not.
 
mudminer

mudminer

Active Member
Nutes and Nugs said:
Atheists have a closed mind or have a hard time using certain parts of their brain.If it cant be scientifically proven, it's all just a bunch of shit to them.A Non-atheist has the ability to "cross over". Their minds are open to a certain religion and faith in that religion and or other religions.It works for me. Dreams, ghosts, premonitions, the voice of logic. Being in a church has a very 'Royal' type feeling to me. To believe and pray has rewarded me with these senses.Sorry I can't explain that to certain people who never crossed over.
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it may not so much be "closed mindedness" just a mind that requires tangibility and explainability. more logic based i suppose.
 
mudminer

mudminer

Active Member
sorry to be responding to these earlier posts so late in the thread but ive just now found it and enjoy participating in these types of dicussions very much cuz im kinda in a transition period myself i guess. ill be able to come further along a little later. peace everyone.
 
GOD HERE

GOD HERE

Well-Known Member
Nutes and Nugs said:

  • Atheists have a closed mind or have a hard time using certain parts of their brain.
    If it cant be scientifically proven, it's all just a bunch of shit to them.​
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Yeah Einstein and some of the other greatest minds seemed like they had real trouble using their brains.
 
Dr Kynes

Dr Kynes

Well-Known Member
Moldy said:
People fucked up the god thing for me. Never trust someone that has to get forgiven once a week.

I've never met a religious person that ain't trying to change my life or someone elses.
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thats evangelism, and most religions are NOT evangelical.

primarily the evangelical religious movements are dogmatic, authoritarian and expansionistic, with some bullshit about dominating the world with their ideology.

examples:

islam
all forms of christianity (from eastern orthodox to catholicism, to mormonism, to iglesia ni christo, every stripe every creed every sect.)
$cientology
marxism


curiously these organizations also tend to be quite driven by profit for their leaders. mullahs, popes, televangelists, and priests always do quite well for themselves (and of course $cientology as an organizations is 100% about the benjamins...) while claiming to be dedicated to some spiritual cause. plus of course the marxist communist utopia is merely a secular re-branding of the religious paradise promise.

i suspect more than a casual connection, perhaps something Causal. but of course examining religious motivations and money invariably results in cries of discrimination, hate and oppression from the believers and their priests (and in the case of islam, racism too, lulz).
 
plantaseedwatchitgrow

plantaseedwatchitgrow

Well-Known Member
I dont have enough faith to be an athiest, ;-)

Theres too many crazy things that have happened to me, where I know there was divine intervention. I'm not saying I believe in heaven, hell, or anything else. I just believe that is all lines up somewhere you know?? Theres something that created all this, whether it be "God" or a giant floating triangle.
 
mindphuk

mindphuk

Well-Known Member
kpmarine said:
That's my problem with atheism: it requires intent and an anthropomorphic God. That teacup (Even the analogy references something man-made.) is only ridiculous to you because it gets related to a dogmatic god. To me, it seems a bit odd to make positive statements, in a universal way, about what can reasonably only be a subjective concept. For me, a spiritual concept of god cannot be universal, only subjective. I cannot say there is or isn't a god definitively, and the only truths on the matter can be subjective; that's my foundation, more or less. It seems all chances of spiritualism are tainted by the Christian god, if you're an atheist. That's why I'm an agnostic; I can't make a definitive call until something particularly compelling happens either way. In a way, I suppose it's a bit ridiculous that this has come to be such a big deal. Religion has been so forced into our society that we have no choice but to 'pick a side'.
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No. Atheism is an accusation leveled by those with belief. Atheism is merely an answer to a claim. Atheism is the default position on the existential question of whether there is a god or not. Look at the root and the modifier-like the difference between morals and amoral, theism and atheism is a binary proposition. You are either a theist or an atheist, nothing in-between. The theist is claiming that there is this entity they call god. Rejecting that claim makes you an atheist. It is quite possible and reasonable to reject true claims, until someone presents evidence, so the atheist is not necessarily saying that the god claim is not true, just that they are withholding judgment, not accepting the claim, until more evidence is presented.

In order to reject a claim, a person must first be presented with one, which would include a description and attributes of this god they are claiming. It is much easier to reject the biblical god with its many contradictions than it is to reject a deistic god, but either way, the lack of evidence makes the atheistic stance reasonable, which is the point of Russel's teapot and the FSM.

Agnosticism OTOH, is asking a different question, can one truly know whether or not there is a god or not? Knowledge is the root word here, and has nothing to do with belief. As Pad pointed out, one can truly believe there is a god or gods but also think that there is no way to actually know for sure. This agnostic theist describes the vast majority of theists. An atheist that rejects all of these claims of gods but still admits that there is no way to know for sure, is an agnostic atheist. If you can't say you believe there is a god, you are automatically in the atheist camp. Unless you an make a positive claim that there are no gods, you are most likely an agnostic atheist.
 
mudminer

mudminer

Active Member
plantaseedwatchitgrow said:
I dont have enough faith to be an athiest, ;-)

Theres too many crazy things that have happened to me, where I know there was divine intervention. I'm not saying I believe in heaven, hell, or anything else. I just believe that is all lines up somewhere you know?? Theres something that created all this, whether it be "God" or a giant floating triangle.
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i guess thats kinda the point that im at. not prepared to say its "divinity" any more but just that my own experiences tell me there is something (physical or spiritual entity, some sort of force or power, whatever anyone wants to call it. put a name on it if'n ya want to.) bigger than us out there, around here what the fuck ever. I dont believe we're alone but i no longer believe theres a grey bearded "guy in the sky" waving his finger around conducting things nor do i believe that it particularly gives a fuck about us one way or another.

I can still accept that there is wisdom in the various "holy books" but there is too much "man" in them for "infallibility" to be even remotely considered.
 
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