What is this crazy problem ???

Dr. Who · Aug 10, 2016

@Stonironi @Afgan King @Dr.Pecker @RM3

AS I THOUGHT......TMV does not infect the Cannabaceae family of plants!
The prof called me back seconds ago. He says that old research and some new show that what we think is a type of MV IS NOT A MOSAIC AT ALL!
They have attempted to infect Hops and other family members ("unofficial" testing in cannabis showed the same results) and it would NOT replicate in the host plant!

He (as always) suggests you treat for BROAD MITES! He has also found the reports of what was thought to be a MV in HEMP fields in the past to be NOT a MV infection. From records research - it appears to be insect or fungal related!

He says that the so - called "test" for TMV is complete hokum and is designed to have you buy a solution that the company shares a money interest in!
THE ONLY way to "test" for a viral infection in plants is to use an electron microscope to actually LOOK for it!

SORRY AK! But you've been had!

Dr. Who · Aug 10, 2016

@Stonironi @Afgan King @Dr.Pecker @RM3

I was directed to a Molecular Biologist at MSU by the AG prof. His specialty is bacterial and viral infections in plants....

HE says the same thing - It's NOT TMV.
The only virus's that the Cannabaceae family of plants can be infected by are ......

Alfalfa mosaic
Arabis mosaic

Alfalfa mosaic is NOT the culprit here either. He states that the plant would show increasing, uneven mottling of the leaves (the whole leaf and NOT just one side!), with possible minor necrosis on leaf edges - NO curling or such. This is transmitted mainly by APHIDS and from seeds infected by infected pollen!

Arabis mosaic, again is not the problem here! He says the virus is expressed and transmitted the same way as Alfalfa mosaic and is rather rarer then Alfalfa because it infects mainly a different family of plant. Mainly berry plants - including your wife or mothers Hosta's!

He stated that for the symptoms I quoted. "It would be better to look to a pest source!"

Well then, I think this finally puts an end to the TMV thing.....

Hope I set some minds at ease here!

RM3 · Aug 10, 2016

Dr. Who said:
@Stonironi @Afgan King @Dr.Pecker @RM3

I was directed to a Molecular Biologist at MSU by the AG prof. His specialty is bacterial and viral infections in plants....

HE says the same thing - It's NOT TMV.
The only virus's that the Cannabaceae family of plants can be infected by are ......

Alfalfa mosaic
Arabis mosaic

Alfalfa mosaic is NOT the culprit here either. He states that the plant would show increasing, uneven mottling of the leaves (the whole leaf and NOT just one side!), with possible minor necrosis on leaf edges - NO curling or such. This is transmitted mainly by APHIDS and from seeds infected by infected pollen!

Arabis mosaic, again is not the problem here! He says the virus is expressed and transmitted the same way as Alfalfa mosaic and is rather rarer then Alfalfa because it infects mainly a different family of plant. Mainly berry plants - including your wife or mothers Hosta's!

He stated that for the symptoms I quoted. "It would be better to look to a pest source!"

Well then, I think this finally puts an end to the TMV thing.....

Hope I set some minds at ease here!

Figured as much, didn't wanna get in an argument over it so I just been watchin

Afgan King · Aug 10, 2016

Dr. Who said:
YEAH, I don't think that's any MV...Not that I've seen in other plants! Just not effecting the plant the same.
If we go by something @Afgan King has posted - it's not falling into that either as it IS forming natural trichs in every pic I blew up to view close.

Gunna give the prof a call later again when he gets home......Got some new questions for him now!

Ya we got got crazy colors of purple pink red and yellow along with the uneven sides. This kinda looks like it but not truly. They colors don't become too defined till down the line. We ran tmv plants for 8 months cloning every 9 days whole warehouse had it barely did shit virus is more than its cracked up to be. Get axium anyways shit makes your plants on like steroids. They are just healthier all around. Everyone makes a big deal about tmv but I bet u every 3rd commercial grow in Denver has it. Seen in multiple warehouses I worked in. I personally don't care bout it is what it is just use different razors when cloning those two and spray with axium barely ever notice it

Dr. Who · Aug 10, 2016

Afgan King said:
Ya we got got crazy colors of purple pink red and yellow along with the uneven sides. This kinda looks like it but not truly. They colors don't become too defined till down the line. We ran tmv plants for 8 months cloning every 9 days whole warehouse had it barely did shit virus is more than its cracked up to be. Get axium anyways shit makes your plants on like steroids. They are just healthier all around. Everyone makes a big deal about tmv but I bet u every 3rd commercial grow in Denver has it. Seen in multiple warehouses I worked in. I personally don't care bout it is what it is just use different razors when cloning those two and spray with axium barely ever notice it

Gotta be something else......Sure would be nice if the fucking DEA would drop it to a sch. 2 !
Then colleges would be free to test and find out just what that is!

Liking the steroid thing - lol AXIOM - derived from bacterial proteins (Harpin) They don't say organic - still interesting. Growth by a form of stress induction...
Might have to try this out!

Afgan King · Aug 10, 2016

Bro it makes a difference and only like lightly mist your plants once a month with it. A gallon in the fogger used to do like 600 plants. They say just spray it into room if one plant gets it any plants it's touching it will be passed onto as well. @Dr. Who you'll love the stuff cheap as dirt too 20$ is like 4 gallons lol can use half or quarter of pack and reseal too it really is a good product nothing but the best to say about it

Dr. Who · Aug 10, 2016

I'll get some! WTF..

Afgan King · Aug 10, 2016

Just follow directions some people don't with horrible results. Rule one as always spray with lights off and wait till dry to turn back on rule 2 follow directions.....didn't think id need to say it but seen posts on how people say it's shit but yet they don't follow directions lmao

Stonironi · Aug 10, 2016

I just picked some up from the grow shop. It was 10 for a quart equivalent . I'm not looking to argue with anyone but I highly doubt I have broad mites. My plants would be destroyed by now. They were in some Kind soil for a couple of months before I transplanted them into my homemade tlo soil and 1 plant had that pattern for the whole time. Bugs don't take a break, they eat until the host is dead and move on.

Dr. Who · Aug 10, 2016

Stonironi said:
I just picked some up from the grow shop. It was 10 for a quart equivalent . I'm not looking to argue with anyone but I highly doubt I have broad mites. My plants would be destroyed by now. They were in some Kind soil for a couple of months before I transplanted them into my homemade tlo soil and 1 plant had that pattern for the whole time. Bugs don't take a break, they eat until the host is dead and move on.

AH HA! You got the "kind Soil" burn on that budding area. Explains the crinkle look on anyplace they (plants) have that. Bet the rest of it is simple vertigated!

Not to be an ass dude.
Broad mites are smaller then hell and kinda slow to spread.....you've got time to catch them if you figure out what it is!
If you've never had them. Kinda hard for you to make a rather broad comment like that.....

Never assume anything.
Logic does not grow plants well.

You react to "problems" rather frantically - not an insult!
But, it kinda says your new to this.

Been doing this for decades....

I was sure right on the TMV part....

"See ya around, kid" ;-)

Stonironi · Aug 10, 2016

Dr. Who said:
AH HA! You got the "kind Soil" burn on that budding area. Explains the crinkle look on anyplace they (plants) have that. Bet the rest of it is simple vertigated!

Not to be an ass dude.
Broad mites are smaller then hell and kinda slow to spread.....you've got time to catch them if you figure out what it is!
If you've never had them. Kinda hard for you to make a rather broad comment like that.....

Never assume anything.
Logic does not grow plants well.

You react to "problems" rather frantically - not an insult!
But, it kinda says your new to this.

Been doing this for decades....

I was sure right on the TMV part....

"See ya around, kid"

I have never had broad mites you are right there. This has been going on for a couple months now but I never seen any bugs with my scope so I figured I did not have them. When leaves start disappearing and turning a weird color then yes I get a little frantic.
I can use all the help I can get for sure.
It isn't like I had one leaf turn yellow from a lack of N and I posted "ahh what is this."
I have variegated leaves that turn left or right and some of them are just disappearing so that is why I asked for help .
Variegation doesn't spread to other genetics does it ?
It probably is bugs but then they must have lived from my grow before this ,see I grew in coco for almost 2 years and I started getting plants that wouldn't finish or wouldn't have hardly any trichome production and hardly any smell and my flavor was junk which I know some of the flavor is lost with coco but I decided that coco was not for me when I had to water 3 times a day for the Meds I was getting from it . I wanted my stuff to be healthy as it could be for me as I'm disabled and need quality over quantity. I tried everything to get my coco up to par and it never happened. I had beautiful plants that tasted like crap and had zero smell. I had a lot of people give me advice and still I never found the problem? So I then got turned on to organic gardening .Long long story short here is ,I'm not jumping to conclusions at all I just cannot figure out what is up with my grow ?
You talk about the kind soil burn ?
Do you know about this soil ?
It causes leaf crinkle ?
Thanks again for your help , pops Lmfao
I'm only kidding !

Afgan King · Aug 10, 2016

Just buy Axiom and thank me later lol

Stonironi · Aug 10, 2016

I used kind soil for the beginning of this grow and my plants barely grew and when I transplanted my roots never grew into the kind soil . They would fill up the base soil and then start to look hungry because they used all that the base soil had. It was not a good soil for me. I've had some bad luck!

Stonironi · Aug 10, 2016

Afgan King said:
Just buy Axiom and thank me later lol

I bought a packet of Axium today I'm gonna spray it on my veg plants tonight which are just one clone each of what I already have Rugburn og and 1 chaos by seedpac. Every one of the clones has the same issue so we will see what they do ? I'm not gonna spray it on my flowering plants as they are already 3 weeks in flower . Thank you lol

Dr. Who · Aug 10, 2016

Stonironi said:
I kinda feel like your trying to be a bit insulting there. I'm almost 40 years old and far from new to this. I have never had broad mites you are right there. This has been going on for a couple months now but I never seen any bugs with my scope so I figured I did not have them. When leaves start disappearing and turning a weird color then yes I get a little frantic.
I can use all the help I can get for sure.
It isn't like I had one leaf turn yellow from a lack of N and I posted "ahh what is this."
I have variegated leaves that turn left or right and some of them are just disappearing so that is why I asked for help .
Variegation doesn't spread to other genetics does it ?
It probably is bugs but then they must have lived from my grow before this ,see I grew in coco for almost 2 years and I started getting plants that wouldn't finish or wouldn't have hardly any trichome production and hardly any smell and my flavor was junk which I know some of the flavor is lost with coco but I decided that coco was not for me when I had to water 3 times a day for the Meds I was getting from it . I wanted my stuff to be healthy as it could be for me as I'm disabled and need quality over quantity. I tried everything to get my coco up to par and it never happened. I had beautiful plants that tasted like crap and had zero smell. I had a lot of people give me advice and still I never found the problem? So I then got turned on to organic gardening .Long long story short here is ,I'm not jumping to conclusions at all I just cannot figure out what is up with my grow ?
You talk about the kind soil burn ?
Do you know about this soil ?
It causes leaf crinkle ?
Thanks again for your help , pops Lmfao
I'm only kidding !

"POPS"

here my good man - LOL! Not trying - really! Gets tough sometimes with all the young uns around, to pick out the more mature people - sorry!

1: You really need like 200 or more magnification to "see" a broad mite....thing is, like I said earlier,,,,they burrow in the leaf stem vein. VERY hard to "see" one at all. NO problem on that, just sharing info on them!

2: Vertigated in it's self, is not a problem! Even a few that may curl towards the multi-colored side. The thing to look for is it to "spread" to a leaf that did not grow out that way after the first formation of the leaf. If as the leaf grows out and you can see a little multi on it - no problem! Watch them with the eye of "that's cool"...

3: KIND SOIL - Yes I'm familiar with it! I've ran it in side by sides with other water only soils (including mine). KIND is VERY hot and VERY uncooked! THAT is ALL the problem your seeing with the wrinkled/crinkled, edge burnt and seemingly missing leaves and leaf parts! I'm sure you layered it as directed. It's just too easy to make the KIND layers too thick and cause the plant to be affected by the hot and not cooked enough soil....Not only that. the poor plant could easily have hit a "hotter spot" in the layer and threw it an overage on something.......I saw this with my own eye's so relax! Your next run with a better soil will go far better!
(you say TLO? You might want to try lowering the long term P source's he has an abundance of...IF you find you get a bit of a P overage in that style).

I hope that clears up some things for you!
I understand now your stressing over the issue! I have 5 patients under me and my wife does too! I can imagine the stress of wondering if your only med source has been screwed up! I think you can relax a bit after our sharing. :hug:

Afgan King · Aug 10, 2016

Stonironi said:
I bought a packet of Axium today I'm gonna spray it on my veg plants tonight which are just one clone each of what I already have Rugburn og and 1 chaos by seedpac. Every one of the clones has the same issue so we will see what they do ? I'm not gonna spray it on my flowering plants as they are already 3 weeks in flower . Thank you lol

We sprayed on flowering plants your actually at the week we would again once in veg once in flower they did 36 days in veg got sprayed day 18 veg and 18 flower lol never had any I'll effects again it's just a protein

claypipe69 · Aug 11, 2016

Looks like leaf miners by the way that only some leaves are affected & new growth is distorted.The baby`s look healthy otherwise.. I would use a citrus miner treatment @ normal strength, I would add to that spray, a very weak trace elements mix emphasising very weak quarter strength. happy gardening :bigjoint:

Remember with trace elements, less is more a lack of Boron can cause leaf distortion on new growth. :joint:

Stonironi · Aug 11, 2016

Thank you . I grow organic so I'm was hoping to not give my plants any Chems . Wouldn't avid or forbid kill the leaf miners as well ?

Stonironi · Aug 11, 2016

Dr. Who said:
"POPS" here my good man - LOL! Not trying - really! Gets tough sometimes with all the young uns around, to pick out the more mature people - sorry!

1: You really need like 200 or more magnification to "see" a broad mite....thing is, like I said earlier,,,,they burrow in the leaf stem vein. VERY hard to "see" one at all. NO problem on that, just sharing info on them!

2: Vertigated in it's self, is not a problem! Even a few that may curl towards the multi-colored side. The thing to look for is it to "spread" to a leaf that did not grow out that way after the first formation of the leaf. If as the leaf grows out and you can see a little multi on it - no problem! Watch them with the eye of "that's cool"...

3: KIND SOIL - Yes I'm familiar with it! I've ran it in side by sides with other water only soils (including mine). KIND is VERY hot and VERY uncooked! THAT is ALL the problem your seeing with the wrinkled/crinkled, edge burnt and seemingly missing leaves and leaf parts! I'm sure you layered it as directed. It's just too easy to make the KIND layers too thick and cause the plant to be affected by the hot and not cooked enough soil....Not only that. the poor plant could easily have hit a "hotter spot" in the layer and threw it an overage on something.......I saw this with my own eye's so relax! Your next run with a better soil will go far better!
(you say TLO? You might want to try lowering the long term P source's he has an abundance of...IF you find you get a bit of a P overage in that style).

I hope that clears up some things for you!
I understand now your stressing over the issue! I have 5 patients under me and my wife does too! I can imagine the stress of wondering if your only med source has been screwed up! I think you can relax a bit after our sharing.

Yeah you have helped me a lot . I'm gonna watch the plants like a hawk . I am positive that it is getting more spots. I have stopped using the kind soil and the plants are now in tlo soil that I made. I will check out the long term p . I know that he sets his soil for reuse and that may be why? I am still learning everyday about organic growing. I don't want to use crap chemicals anymore. Hopefully I can get it figured out soon .

Stonironi · Aug 11, 2016

Afgan King said:
We sprayed on flowering plants your actually at the week we would again once in veg once in flower they did 36 days in veg got sprayed day 18 veg and 18 flower lol never had any I'll effects again it's just a protein

I read it can cause hermie plants in flower ?

What is this crazy problem ???

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