DCobeen
Well-Known Member
lol according to area51 no led panel using color led's are the way to go. they will grow just not use the whole spectrum.Meanwhile, Hans panel seems to contain the best of all worlds
Lighting questions.. Considering LED over hps/mh combo
- Thread starter jartlow
- Start date
prosperian
Well-Known Member
Lol, I'm just going to stop reading this thread, too many newbs with card board grow boxes and visions of grandeur.Meanwhile, Hans panel seems to contain the best of all worlds
Good luck everybody, I'm out of here.
Shaded420
Well-Known Member
Sorry, what's wrong with my setup? It grows plants right? Or are you just here to be a giant douche bag?
Where exactly are these magical visions of grandeur?
Shaded420
Well-Known Member
Hans uses R/B/W...it was you who just stated that even pure white LED is not optimal - red for flower is.
monkeychief
Well-Known Member
Here's a little inside scoop in case you didn't know. Apache Tech if I recall is made up of 3-4 engineers and scientists who started it as a side business. They haven't invested much time and resources into the business it's not economically feasible yet and it shows as their website reflects this lack of investment. The are quite humble considering their credentials. Their panels were also the ones used by NASA and Standford for their experimentation on the application of leds as a reliable light source for photosynthesis. I think them not changing their spectrum that they introduced almost five yrs. is a testament to their credentials. It also took the market almost that time to catch up and realize that they hit it on the head the first time out because they are the true insiders. Working with and at their facility, financed by these two guys so u know cost was definitely not a consideration as it shows in their design, to fit and finish. U can also tell by the pics that the lighter more whitish had better lateral growth and less stretching. Like I said, I haven't had a chance to flower yet but so far it no red-flag to talk about except the stretch. This is expected cause it's spec. is very similar to HPS, which also causes the same type of stretching.
Again. I'm not endorsed or sponsored by Apache nor any in that case because the truth is the truth, good or bad. If it talks like a duck, walks like a duck, it can't be a chicken???
monkeychief
Well-Known Member
Stoner
Join DateJan 2014
Posts839
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Originally Posted by Shaded420 
Meanwhile, Hans panel seems to contain the best of all worlds
lol according to area51 no led panel using color led's are the way to go. they will grow just not use the whole spectrum.
Originally Posted by DCobeen
lol according to area51 no led panel using color led's are the way to go. they will grow just not use the whole spectrum.
Hans uses R/B/W...it was you who just stated that even pure white LED is not optimal - red for flower is.
Join DateDec 2010
LocationUnder artificial lightingPosts3,149
[h=2]
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Posts839
[h=2]
Meanwhile, Hans panel seems to contain the best of all worlds
lol according to area51 no led panel using color led's are the way to go. they will grow just not use the whole spectrum.
lol according to area51 no led panel using color led's are the way to go. they will grow just not use the whole spectrum.
Hans uses R/B/W...it was you who just stated that even pure white LED is not optimal - red for flower is.
Join DateDec 2010LocationUnder artificial lightingPosts3,149
[h=2]
Alright so I figured I'd give a quick weight before I bounce out the door...........the buds are actually pretty dry due to the low rh here in North east for the last couple days/maybe one more day max....
weight.....
....so 49.3grams which includes 1&2 and all the popcorn shit(ha ate some too for my flight!)......off of 56 watts led....... 65w full actual draw(driver&fan)....but I ran most of their veg at 28w and 43w for a couple too, so id say it would be fair to average around 50-55w total till finish........blah
*first I'd like too say that the panel is great and this was not a proper TEST for it due to me force flowering these crappy auto's*
lesson learned....
-I would think long and hard about running auto's under this particular panel.....not a good fit IMO
-If your gonna run cocco either go straight(w perlite and correct ph/cocco nutes) or use it as an amendment(no more than 30%)in your mix
-Also don't lst or excessively move your plants in smartpots with cocco.....the roots shift easily and can tear as you saw with my #1's root system which was a fifth the size of #2 and honestly was surprised that it yielded anything(#2 root system wasn't that impressive either due to the constant movement for pics)
-A sealed summer room with no ac/no intake or exhaust works ....but me not being able to supplement co2 halfway through and the constant temps over 85f decreased my yields(id say a total of 30 out of 100days it was below 85)....this would not have worked without a low wattage led IMO.......
-I still believe that less is more under leds.....less water/less nutes! even with my high temps water and nute uptake was slow...I even overfertlized the girls at really low doses....which I couldn't believe, but that's what they showed......
-This panel can easily achieve 1g per watt....If both my girls where the same, this grow would have been a success in my eyes(even with this bad pheno I had/ can only imagine what a great hybrid could do)....but I had to many firsts in this grow and it showed
Well that's it and I'm outta here..........i'll stay in touch with my phone............much love RIU.......next round should be up in three weeks..........be safe and happy growing!!!
Granted all the possible mistakes that he could of made because an experiment is usually thrown out the door when there's a excuse must be given for a miserable fail. Geez even with that excuse at 49g for $295 is the big rip-off only for people who are misinformed or inexperience. For that price u should be getting worst scenario the minimum with no experience and some common sense should be getting at least 3x as much at 100g. I dn't have time now but I will later if anyone is intersested.
weight.....
....so 49.3grams which includes 1&2 and all the popcorn shit(ha ate some too for my flight!)......off of 56 watts led....... 65w full actual draw(driver&fan)....but I ran most of their veg at 28w and 43w for a couple too, so id say it would be fair to average around 50-55w total till finish........blah*first I'd like too say that the panel is great and this was not a proper TEST for it due to me force flowering these crappy auto's*
lesson learned....
-I would think long and hard about running auto's under this particular panel.....not a good fit IMO
-If your gonna run cocco either go straight(w perlite and correct ph/cocco nutes) or use it as an amendment(no more than 30%)in your mix
-Also don't lst or excessively move your plants in smartpots with cocco.....the roots shift easily and can tear as you saw with my #1's root system which was a fifth the size of #2 and honestly was surprised that it yielded anything(#2 root system wasn't that impressive either due to the constant movement for pics)
-A sealed summer room with no ac/no intake or exhaust works ....but me not being able to supplement co2 halfway through and the constant temps over 85f decreased my yields(id say a total of 30 out of 100days it was below 85)....this would not have worked without a low wattage led IMO.......
-I still believe that less is more under leds.....less water/less nutes! even with my high temps water and nute uptake was slow...I even overfertlized the girls at really low doses....which I couldn't believe, but that's what they showed......
-This panel can easily achieve 1g per watt....If both my girls where the same, this grow would have been a success in my eyes(even with this bad pheno I had/ can only imagine what a great hybrid could do)....but I had to many firsts in this grow and it showed
Well that's it and I'm outta here..........i'll stay in touch with my phone............much love RIU.......next round should be up in three weeks..........be safe and happy growing!!!
Granted all the possible mistakes that he could of made because an experiment is usually thrown out the door when there's a excuse must be given for a miserable fail. Geez even with that excuse at 49g for $295 is the big rip-off only for people who are misinformed or inexperience. For that price u should be getting worst scenario the minimum with no experience and some common sense should be getting at least 3x as much at 100g. I dn't have time now but I will later if anyone is intersested.
PaxEtBonum
Member
Yo. I've been watching discussions on here where people champion panels that are like the Buick of panels (hey, it's not too expensive and gets you to work). Look, I spent two decades growing, before law was on my side, and before I ever considered LED as a possibility. Then I watched the shit panels disappoint people, and people applaud mediocre panels, rather than investing in great panels. You find a panel with 10W Crees, UVB, and all the spectrums, you marry that girl, son.
I did, and I won't look back or listen to arguments about which 600 panel is better than which 300 panel. Drop the money on a quality panel. No switching between spectrums, no heat (four fans and four heatsinks per panel) and a warranty to beat hell that I've never had to use.
It'll cost you a penny. But two of my plants paid for all three panels. First go round. No circus shit.
Advanced LED (US company, sent me three free bulbs and continue to check in on my happiness with the panels and ask if they are functioning well and if I'm cleaning the dust guards and etc). Here you go. Again, the LED discussion, the world of it, is filled with people who pray to the ones they bought and celebrate them profusely. Funny thing is, I bought mine to cut down on consumption and embrace organic sustainability and maintain yields. These lights beat my 1000w and 600w HPS into dirt. I gave my HPS digs to a friend's kid after one run with these, but I told him to get into LED after his first run. It's smarter, better, provided you avoid snake oil salesman.
You can expect it to be a five or so years until the other companies get on board with CREE technology; unless they have since I first grabbed my gear, but they weren't at the time and I haven't checked up on companies that were underperforming when I bought this (but they were, in many ways). Don't give me that HANS panel bullshit, because they are shit compared to these; a buddy owns two and my shit blue his mind. Do you want a swedish motorbike or a harley? Listen, you've got X hours and months per grow and X grows per year. You want to piss that away saving a few bucks upfront. The plants know what they want. They want it good. So treat them good .
This is early on in flowering. Let the negative nancies commence bitching about how these lights cost twice what their lights cost. Yeah, that happens. It's called cost per performance value. A Lamborghini costs more than a Buick. Vroom.
I did, and I won't look back or listen to arguments about which 600 panel is better than which 300 panel. Drop the money on a quality panel. No switching between spectrums, no heat (four fans and four heatsinks per panel) and a warranty to beat hell that I've never had to use.
It'll cost you a penny. But two of my plants paid for all three panels. First go round. No circus shit.
Advanced LED (US company, sent me three free bulbs and continue to check in on my happiness with the panels and ask if they are functioning well and if I'm cleaning the dust guards and etc). Here you go. Again, the LED discussion, the world of it, is filled with people who pray to the ones they bought and celebrate them profusely. Funny thing is, I bought mine to cut down on consumption and embrace organic sustainability and maintain yields. These lights beat my 1000w and 600w HPS into dirt. I gave my HPS digs to a friend's kid after one run with these, but I told him to get into LED after his first run. It's smarter, better, provided you avoid snake oil salesman.
You can expect it to be a five or so years until the other companies get on board with CREE technology; unless they have since I first grabbed my gear, but they weren't at the time and I haven't checked up on companies that were underperforming when I bought this (but they were, in many ways). Don't give me that HANS panel bullshit, because they are shit compared to these; a buddy owns two and my shit blue his mind. Do you want a swedish motorbike or a harley? Listen, you've got X hours and months per grow and X grows per year. You want to piss that away saving a few bucks upfront. The plants know what they want. They want it good. So treat them good .
This is early on in flowering. Let the negative nancies commence bitching about how these lights cost twice what their lights cost. Yeah, that happens. It's called cost per performance value. A Lamborghini costs more than a Buick. Vroom.
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PaxEtBonum
Member
And don't even bother commenting on the plants themselves. That straggler in the back craning this way and that is a Landrace sativa I brought back with me between my toes from Seirra Leone. Otherwise, carry on about the panels. Advanced is the best I've ever used. I use my 51, which someone convinced me to buy on this forum, for vegging only and I only use it at all because I wasted money on it. My t5's could handle the job but I can't stand feeling this suckered by others, so I put it to work.
jartlow
Well-Known Member
Very interesting. . But why do you say your 51 is crap? Also have you came across apache? Advanced sells their lights in the same price as apache..
Do you feel like the http://www.advancedledlights.com/3w-led-grow-lights/new-diamond-series-xml-10w-cree-xml/ will beat the 51 in flowering stage?
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-N900A using Rollitup mobile app
DCobeen
Well-Known Member
Area 51 on theri own website says that there light isnt affective at filling the light spectrum right now. there own words. i was blown away when i read that.
Shaded420
Well-Known Member
Hans panels are constantly changing, how do you know your friend wasn't using a panel that was 2-3 years old? His panels are fucking fine for the right setup and sure as hell a lot less expensive, and he uses CREE's now....way to trump your own horn though.
Why the fuck would I need 10w cree LED's to cover a smaller than 2x2 coverage area?
You mean your friends $250 65w Hans panel couldn't compare to your 150-300w LED that cost close to $800?
Why the fuck would I need 10w cree LED's to cover a smaller than 2x2 coverage area?
You mean your friends $250 65w Hans panel couldn't compare to your 150-300w LED that cost close to $800?
They say that their white lights aren't the most effective for veg, but are more than optimal for flowering (which is what most of us care about anyways)
Eraserhead
Well-Known Member
DCobeen
Well-Known Member
ill have to find it i posted the whole story somewhere. i looked again and am not finding it.
Eraserhead
Well-Known Member
You are not finding it, because it's not there. Never was.
Area 51 never said "their light isn't effective at filling the light spectrum".
Where do you come up with this nonsense?
Area 51 never said "their light isn't effective at filling the light spectrum".
Where do you come up with this nonsense?
Eraserhead
Well-Known Member
Area 51 never worked with Nasa. Maybe you're thinking of Apache Tech. They worked with Nasa.
DCobeen
Well-Known Member
i know it was canadians with area51 and the project has something to do with growing in space. i knew i should have saved to a doc on pc. this is why area51 is coming out with a new white light led panel. they said with white led's they can cover the whole spectrum but have to research it to get the balance right. so when they come out with the all white led it will be the best. it was a long read i know that.
Eraserhead
Well-Known Member
I think I know what you're talking about....
A51 used to work with Fero Canada in 2011 and part of 2012. Fero Europe separated with Fero Canada shortly after A51 separated from them.
Somewhere during all that mess, Fero Europe wrote up some article for some webpage and mentioned something about growing in space and mentioned A51's name in there.
Fero Europe used A51's name without A51's permission, A51 would not have given them permission for that article, because it is all lies.
I can assure you that A51 never once worked with Nasa. A51 never grew anything in space. A51 never have even been to space, yet...
That was a pretty asinine article....
A51 used to work with Fero Canada in 2011 and part of 2012. Fero Europe separated with Fero Canada shortly after A51 separated from them.
Somewhere during all that mess, Fero Europe wrote up some article for some webpage and mentioned something about growing in space and mentioned A51's name in there.
Fero Europe used A51's name without A51's permission, A51 would not have given them permission for that article, because it is all lies.
I can assure you that A51 never once worked with Nasa. A51 never grew anything in space. A51 never have even been to space, yet...
That was a pretty asinine article....
BubbaGum
Well-Known Member
What he said. if you just want to see what you can do short term Blackstars have produced excellent plants too just not great longterm. A few journals for you to checkout:
Wejuana Comeback! < LED vs LED > **Blackstar Chrome 720 VS Penetrator 336X** - Page 6
Beef's Area-51 LED grow! ***WW, BC BB, C99, Purps, Neville's Haze, Moby Dick***
https://www.rollitup.org/led-other-lighting/542556-dawg-house-grow-featuring-area.html
WeJuana does a few comparison grows that'll help you.