lights that are cooled?? HOW.........

uptosumpn

Well-Known Member
Me Too! I dont want anything hanging out of a window or installed outdoors!!!
So with that said, are you saying just buy the "expensive" ASS ChillKing from the start? :sad::sad: because I was thinking about getting this one, ( I KNOW YOUR GONNA CUSS ME )http://www.growlightexpress.com/water-chillers-60/ecoplus-1-2-hp-water-chiller-488.html with this pump,
http://www.growlightexpress.com/pumps-irrigation-41/water-pumps-43/ecoplus-1500-elite-submersible-pump-902.html
Half the price of the ChillKing chiller, and your only losing 600btu's....Ya think it could work for 1 1000hps and 2 8" Iceboxes??

And Where could I put it?? I dont have a attic or crawl space in this RENTAL house! (will be buying next year, I hope!?) and really cant put THE CHILLER in another room, (only have 3bdrms)...I already have to deal wid the misses complaining about my new hobby, plus making sure my kid dont see the op in the spare bedroom..don't wanna have her go mistakely tell her friends @ school, "my daddy grows plants!!!":leaf::dunce::cuss:
LOL!:lol: That shit anit funny!


""and I don't want anything hanging out a window or installed outdoors.""

you could TRY putting the chiller in the attic next to a attic vent but it may be too stuffy and hot up there.

as far as not wanting to buy a expensive chiller, nobody wants to!
If I have learned one thing in this industry, its buy the good/right stuff the first time or else you will end up upgrading and buying everything twice and installing everything twice, and that does not save any money...
 

jberry

Well-Known Member
hydro stores, wielding supply, fire extinguisher supply places, and places that sell fountain drink machines and supplies should all have co2 tanks... or be able to fill your tank.

should be under a dollar a pound.
 

uptosumpn

Well-Known Member
OMG!!!, That's my point! I couldn't agree more!!!:leaf::leaf::leaf:


I agree with both of these points.

Looking at chiller performance curves it's easy to see that temps around the chiller have a big impact. The chillers I looked at don't even operate above 90F.

I definitely know what you mean by having to do things twice. Been there, done that. I don't want to take hydro innovations word, however, that an aquarium chiller wouldn't work given that they sell the only thing else on the block that I've found. There's may be more efficient but I'm looking for something I can stick in the adjoining room that doesn't sound like a converted window shaker. I don't know what the noise specs on either types are since I can't find them anywhere but I'd bet that the hydro innovation chillers sound just like what they are: A/C units.
 

jberry

Well-Known Member
Me Too! I dont want anything hanging out of a window or installed outdoors!!!
So with that said, are you saying just buy the "expensive" ASS ChillKing from the start? :sad::sad: because I was thinking about getting this one, ( I KNOW YOUR GONNA CUSS ME )http://www.growlightexpress.com/water-chillers-60/ecoplus-1-2-hp-water-chiller-488.html with this pump,
http://www.growlightexpress.com/pumps-irrigation-41/water-pumps-43/ecoplus-1500-elite-submersible-pump-902.html
Half the price of the ChillKing chiller, and your only losing 600btu's....Ya think it could work for 1 1000hps and 2 8" Iceboxes??

And Where could I put it?? I dont have a attic or crawl space in this RENTAL house! (will be buying next year, I hope!?) and really cant put THE CHILLER in another room, (only have 3bdrms)...I already have to deal wid the misses complaining about my new hobby, plus making sure my kid dont see the op in the spare bedroom..don't wanna have her go mistakely tell her friends @ school, "my daddy grows plants!!!":leaf::dunce::cuss:
LOL!:lol: That shit anit funny!
you might be out of luck if you dont have anywhere to put the chiller... if you do a room inside a room than MAYBE it would work ONLY if the room with the chiller was vented well enough that the exhaust wasnt just being counter productive...
 

uptosumpn

Well-Known Member
that's what I was asking fatfarmer if he thought the one on e-bay could do the job, (same goddamm btu's...6000!!) hell if it does, do you know how much money we all could save!!!!
 

mihjaro

Active Member
you might be out of luck if you dont have anywhere to put the chiller... if you do a room inside a room than MAYBE it would work ONLY if the room with the chiller was vented well enough that the exhaust wasnt just being counter productive...
I think this could easily be done. For instance, I have a closet in my house which holds my gas water heater. This closet runs about 10 degrees above ambient and uses passive venting into the attic alone. I would think that a 1/2 HP chiller would definitely produce less heat than a 60 gallon natural gas water heater. Again, I could be totally wrong about this.
 

That 5hit

Well-Known Member
maybe this will work for you (or kill you, LOL )


BURNING HYDROCARBON FUELS:
This has been the most common method of CO2 enrichment for many years. A number of commercial growers and greenhouses use it in their larger structures. The most common fuels are propane, butane, alcohol and natural gas. Any of these fuels that burn with a blue, white or colorless flame will produce carbon dioxide, which is beneficial. If a red, orange or yellow flame is present, carbon monoxide is being generated due to incomplete combustion. Carbon monoxide is deadly to both plants and people in any but the smallest quantities. Fuels containing sulfur or sulfur compounds should not be used, as they produce by-products which are harmful.
Most commercial CO2 generators that burn these fuels are too large for small greenhouse or indoor grow room applications. Some small ones are avai fable or a Coleman lantern, bunsen burner or small gas stove can be used. All of these CO2 generators produce heat as a by-product of CO2 generation, which is rarely needed in a controlled environment grow room but may prove beneficial in winter growing and cool area greenhouses.
The rate of CO2 production is controlled by the rate at which fuel is being burned. In a gas burning CO2 generator using propane, butane or natural gas, one pound of fuel produces approximately 3 pounds of carbon dioxide gas and about 1.5 pounds of water vapor. Approximately 22,000 BTUs of heat is also added. These figures can vary if other fuels are used.
To relate this to our standard example in an 8' X 8' X 8' growing area, if you used ethyl or methyl alcohol in a gas lamp or burner at the rate of 1.3 oz. per day, we would enhance the atmospheric concentration of CO2 to 1300 PPM if the room was completely sealed.
An enrichment standard of 1300 PPM was chosen as it is assumed that 1500 PPM is ideal, and that the plants will deplete the available CO2 supply by 100 PPM per hour. Remember, the normal atmosphere contains 300 PPM of CO2. A 100% air exchange (leakage) every two hours is assumed to be the average air exchange rate in most grow rooms and tight greenhouses. If many cracks and leaks are present, this exchange rate will increase significantly, but added CO2 (above 300 PPM) will also be lost. If a vent fan is in use, disregard CO2 enrichment, as it will be blown out as fast as it is generated.
 

stumps

Well-Known Member
please just remember co2 diplaces o2 no o2 no life. Just talked to a buddy at a welding supply out fit we agree we would not want a co2 system in a home. We have both seen fellow workers go down becouse of co2.
 

jberry

Well-Known Member
I think this could easily be done. For instance, I have a closet in my house which holds my gas water heater. This closet runs about 10 degrees above ambient and uses passive venting into the attic alone. I would think that a 1/2 HP chiller would definitely produce less heat than a 60 gallon natural gas water heater. Again, I could be totally wrong about this.
i think the main difference is your hot water heater doesnt have a fan built into it thats blows hot exhaust out for 12-18 hours a day and the chiller DOES.
your hot water tank is also designed to hold in heat and only turns on after some of the stored hot water is used which is probably only a few times a day.
 

jberry

Well-Known Member
one last thought...

i hate to burst everyones bubble but if you do not have a A/C and you do not have a portable Dehumidifier in the room, than you will probably end up having some pretty serious condensation and humidity problems due to the ice boxes and the cold water lines...
you can try rapping/insulating your pvc pipe, but the ice boxes may actually fill up with water, since they will be the only form of dehumidifing the room...

this is a major factor!! you need a duhumidifier, which is basicly a electric heater in your room!

Nothing like running a A/C and a heater at the same time right?

sometimes its tricky to create nature.
 

mihjaro

Active Member
one last thought...

i hate to burst everyones bubble but if you do not have a A/C and you do not have a portable Dehumidifier in the room, than you will probably end up having some pretty serious condensation and humidity problems due to the ice boxes and the cold water lines...
you can try rapping/insulating your pvc pipe, but the ice boxes may actually fill up with water, since they will be the only form of dehumidifing the room...
Very true. The IceBoxes have a hole to allow for the removal of the condensation. I was planning on running that water into my drip irrigation system.

Wrapping the water conduits should work as well as A/C cooling lines which is very well as I don't have water in my walls or attic from the A/C supply lines.

ETA: That condensed water should be just as good as distilled or RO water and it's a byproduct.
 

mihjaro

Active Member
i think the main difference is your hot water heater doesnt have a fan built into it thats blows hot exhaust out for 12-18 hours a day and the chiller DOES.
your hot water tank is also designed to hold in heat and only turns on after some of the stored hot water is used which is probably only a few times a day.
Touche. The chiller closet would need a more active heat exhaust system for sure. The thing is though, I know people who run these things to cool aquarium water and they don't do alot of special stuff. Mostly just passive venting.
 

That 5hit

Well-Known Member
i hate when people say CO2 is poison, its not
people tend to get these confused

Poison
Carbon monoxide, with the chemical formula CO, is a colorless, odorless and tasteless, yet highly toxic gas. Its molecules consist of one carbon atom and one oxygen atom, connected by a covalent double bond and a dative covalent bond. It is the simplest oxocarbon, and can be viewed as the anhydride of formic acid (CH2O2).
Toxicity
Carbon monoxide poisoning is the most common type of fatal poisoning in many countries.[4] Carbon monoxide is colorless and odorless, but extremely toxic: it combines with hemoglobin in the blood to produce carboxyhemoglobin (HbCO), which is ineffective for delivering oxygen to the body tissues (a condition known as anoxemia). Concentrations as low as 667 ppm can cause up to 50% of the body's hemoglobin to convert to HbCO. In the United States, OSHA limits long-term workplace exposure levels to 50 ppm.[5]
The most common symptoms of CO poisoning can resemble the flu, including headache, nausea and vomiting, dizziness, lethargy and a feeling of weakness. Infants may be irritable and feed poorly. Neurological signs include confusion, disorientation, visual disturbance, syncope and seizures.[1]
In his pioneering 1846 study, Claude Bernard observed that the blood of poisoned dogs was more rutilant ("gleaming"[6] or "glowing"[7]) in all the vessels, a fact now known to be due to the formation of HbCO. Some classic descriptions of CO poisoning cite also retinal hemorrhages, bright reddish skin, and an abnormal "cherry-red" blood hue;[8] but in most clinical diagnoses these signs are seldom seen.[1]
Carbon monoxide is believed to compromise other important molecules such as myoglobin, and mitochondrial cytochrome oxidase. Exposures can lead to significant damage to the heart and central nervous system, especially to the globus pallidus,[9] often with long-term sequelae. Carbon monoxide can also have severe effects on the fetus of a pregnant woman.


Not poison
Carbon dioxide (chemical formula: CO2) is a chemical compound composed of two oxygen atoms covalently bonded to a single carbon atom. CO2 is toxic in higher concentrations: 1% (10,000 ppm) will make some people feel drowsy.[2] Concentrations of 7% to 10% cause dizziness, headache, visual and hearing dysfunction, and unconsciousness within a few minutes to an hour. It is a gas at standard temperature and pressure and exists in Earth's atmosphere in this state.
Carbon dioxide is used by plants during photosynthesis to make sugars, which may either be consumed in respiration or used as the raw material to produce other organic compounds needed for plant growth and development. It is produced during respiration by plants, and by all animals, fungi and microorganisms that depend either directly or indirectly on plants for food. It is thus a major component of the carbon cycle. Carbon dioxide is generated as a by-product of the combustion of fossil fuels or the burning of vegetable matter, among other chemical processes. Small amounts of carbon dioxide are emitted from volcanoes and other geothermal processes such as hot springs and geysers and by the dissolution of carbonates in crustal rocks
Toxicity
Main symptoms of Carbon dioxide toxicity, by increasing volume percent in air.[2][36].
Carbon dioxide content in fresh air (averaged between sea-level and 10 hPa level, i.e. about 30 km altitude) varies between 0.036% (360 ppm) and 0.039% (390 ppm), depending on the location[37].
Prolonged exposure to moderate concentrations can cause acidosis and adverse effects on calcium phosphorus metabolism resulting in increased calcium deposits in soft tissue. Carbon dioxide is toxic to the heart and causes diminished contractile force.[36]
Toxicity and its effects increase with the concentration of CO2, here given in volume percent of CO2 in the air:
we use -1500 ppm
1% = 10,000 ppm

1%, as can occur in a crowded auditorium with poor ventilation, can cause drowsiness with prolonged exposure.[2]

2% it is mildly narcotic and causes increased blood pressure and pulse rate, and causes reduced hearing.[36]

5% it causes stimulation of the respiratory centre, dizziness, confusion and difficulty in breathing accompanied by headache and shortness of breath.[36]
8% it causes headache, sweating, dim vision, tremor and loss of consciousness after exposure for between five and ten minutes.[36]

it in and used for
Drinks
Carbon dioxide is used to produce carbonated soft drinks and soda water. Traditionally, the carbonation in beer and sparkling wine came about through natural fermentation, but many manufacturers carbonate these drinks artificially. In the case of bottled and kegged beer, artificial carbonation is now the most common method used. With the exception of British Real Ale, draught (draft) beer is usually transferred from kegs in a cold room or cellar to dispensing taps on the bar using pressurised carbon dioxide, often mixed with nitrogen.
[edit] Foods
A candy called Pop Rocks is pressurized with carbon dioxide gas at about 40 bar (600 psi). When placed in the mouth, it dissolves (just like other hard candy) and releases the gas bubbles with an audible pop.
Leavening agents produce carbon dioxide to cause dough to rise. Baker's yeast produces carbon dioxide by fermentation of sugars within the dough, while chemical leaveners such as baking powder and baking soda release carbon dioxide when heated or if exposed to acids.
Caffeine removal
Liquid carbon dioxide is a good solvent for many lipophilic organic compounds, and is used to remove caffeine from coffee. First, the green coffee beans are soaked in water. The beans are placed in the top of a column seventy feet (21 m) high. Then supercritical carbon dioxide in fluid form at about 93 degrees Celsius enters at the bottom of the column. The caffeine diffuses out of the beans and into the carbon dioxide

CO2 only displaces O2
CO not only displaces O2 but kills brain cells and other cells in the body
 

That 5hit

Well-Known Member
co2 will still kill you dead as any poison
:wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall:
your thinking CO
not
CO2

have you even looked up CO2
show me any site thats says co2 is poison

co2 will not kill you
every soda you drink contains co2
bread, beer, cakes, the air you breath
co2 is not a poison
it would take well over 40,000 ppms to even give you a headache
where would you even find 40,000 ppms of CO2
we use -1500 ppm
1% = 10,000 ppm


1%, as can occur in a crowded auditorium with poor ventilation, can cause drowsiness with prolonged exposure.[2]

2% it is mildly narcotic and causes increased blood pressure and pulse rate, and causes reduced hearing.[36]

5% it causes stimulation of the respiratory centre, dizziness, confusion and difficulty in breathing accompanied by headache and shortness of breath.[36]
8% it causes headache, sweating, dim vision, tremor and loss of consciousness after exposure for between five and ten minutes.[36]
 

stumps

Well-Known Member
I'll phrase it different. If you cracked a valve in closed room not air tight. and went to sleep you would not wake up. co2 is one of the most dangerous
gasses out. I've seen guys go down outside in open air with only 20 cylinders draining. the shit hangs and displaces o2 if you get a couple good shots in your lungs it removes all the o2. I worked at a gas plant for 13 years I've been trained and trained employee's on how to handle and fill the following gases o2,n2,he,ar,co2.nh3,c2h2,propane and anhydrous ammonia. just a little back ground. use it if you like. Just hope nothing goes wrong. I hate reading about a kid that got caught in dads grow room and died. oh one more thing if you look at a co2 valve it has a burst disk on the back side. those get weak and pop off all the time. When that happens all the co2 dumps at one time. you just went from 1200ppms to enough co2 take all the o2 out of a 12x12 room
 

jberry

Well-Known Member
my co2 monitor had a warning saying co2 levels over 5000 ppm's could be dangerous to humans and animals if that helps.
 
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