IS FLUSHING WITH CARBS OK?!> thats what homie said...

[Vento]

I just flushed with plain water... Then ran a couple of buckets of water with pure honey ( melted and mixed in warm water ) thru them , Next flush will just be pure water

Why ?

Coz i wanted to try it ...Then check the results at harvest ,if it shows some good ...i will continue to do it ... if it don't ...Nothing lost

 

[tet1953]

It is worth mentioning the difference between flushing and leaching. I believe that in the context of this thread we are talking about flushing (especially as it relates to soil grows), which is simply switching to plain water or water with a clearing agent like Clearex. Leaching, which is running several times the container's size of water through it, is used usually in dire circumstances when something bad is in the soil and you need to get rid of it.

 

[cowboylogic]

It is worth mentioning the difference between flushing and leaching. I believe that in the context of this thread we are talking about flushing (especially as it relates to soil grows), which is simply switching to plain water or water with a clearing agent like Clearex. Leaching, which is running several times the container's size of water through it, is used usually in dire circumstances when something bad is in the soil and you need to get rid of it.

Either way you are trying to accomplish the same thing. Remove excessive nutes. Most consider the def of flushing-running 3 times the container volume of water through the pot. Clearex or not.

 

[solarguy]

It is worth mentioning the difference between flushing and leaching. I believe that in the context of this thread we are talking about flushing (especially as it relates to soil grows), which is simply switching to plain water or water with a clearing agent like Clearex. Leaching, which is running several times the container's size of water through it, is used usually in dire circumstances when something bad is in the soil and you need to get rid of it.

this statement cleared up some confusion, i was always wondering why its a flush if its normal water amount and plain water...why not just call it "watering". Now it makes sense i can flush by using plain water consistently to clean away the deposits....

my ? is why did we give it all these nutes and then want to take it away? how can it effect the taste? and is the taste the only thing in jeopardy when deciding to flush or not?

 

[VICTORYGARDENSHYDRO]

flushing is for hydro guys, as was stated by the smart guys, if your feeding your plant the proper amount of nutrition, there should be nothing to flush out, Because the plant is using what your feeding it, if your trying to pump your plant and OVERFEED it, you will need to flush away the EXTRA nutes, that YOU gave it. GEt it?

 

[cowboylogic]

flushing is for hydro guys, as was stated by the smart guys, if your feeding your plant the proper amount of nutrition, there should be nothing to flush out, Because the plant is using what your feeding it, if your trying to pump your plant and OVERFEED it, you will need to flush away the EXTRA nutes, that YOU gave it. GEt it?

I think sometimes its the simplicity that makes it difficult for some to grasp. All we can do is keep trying Victory.

 

[solarguy]

thanks guys, i understand a lot more now....

 

[GibbsIt89]

just caught up on the thread.. i believe in flushing becuz i dont have any meters other then ph drops, ph digital soil meter, and i use distilled water with a ppm of 0 so i dont have to worry about extra salts.. i probly wont flush once i get my feeding down pat.. i also use a "soiless mix" called "pro-mix hp", "hp" stands for "high perosity" which basically means well airated.. it has more pearlite in it then vermaculite so it drys out quicker and i can get in more feeds.. it has no nutrient value in it becuz i am hand feeding. hope that helps a little.. im a newb tho, but everything im doing makes sense, i should be taking it a little lighter on the nutes this round

 

[solarguy]

these are 180 watt panels, 6 watt bulbs...no joke...check out the grow in my sig

 

[GibbsIt89]

these are 180 watt panels, 6 watt bulbs...no joke...check out the grow in my sig

ya i edited my post there, realized they werent like mine at all.. i just purchased mine for a little side grow i can fit in a 2'x2' space for autogrowers or whatever.. just something to fuck with lol. it is compared to a 250watt HID apparently.. 45 1watt bulbs dual spectrum i payed $140 for it, it just seemed like a good idea at the time haha.. but i am def. going to test it out, nice LEDs tho man

 

[Brick Top]

with this idea set aside, please help bricktop in know your full of answers!

Annuals, which cannabis plants are, experience an internal process triggered by light cycle changes, the shortening of days, called Senescence. An annual plant will begin to concentrate it's efforts into producing fruits and/or seed to insure future generations. This process is typically hormonally induced and begins when the light cycle begins to diminish. Eventually, under conditions related to senescence, the plant will slow photosynthesis on it's own and naturally draw nutrients from fan leaves to relocate energy into reproduction. Annual plants will essentially "flush" themselves, basically to death, all to develop healthy seed. It is a natural and predictable process.

When it happens plants naturally take in less moisture and less nutrients, or anything else in the soil, than before so how much would you think some super flushing agent or last minute bud pumper upper will actually be able to do since plants have altered what they do and are taking in less from the soil and using up more of what they have stored?

Until I read something that is beyond question that such products are worth using I have to continue to believe the best thing is to flush normally so what little nutrients left in the soil that might be used by plants will no longer remain in the soil to be used so the plants will more fully use up what they have stored.

 

[Brick Top]

And starving your plants the last few weeks when they are bulking up the most, just foolish. But to each thier own.

You really aren't "starving your plants the last few weeks." In an annual, like cannabis plants are, they cut back on both moisture and nutrient uptake, mainly in the last few weeks of flowering, and they basically flush themselves, they are genetically coded to use up as much stored carbohydrates as they can, so it is not as if they are being starved by someone cutting back how much they feed them because they will use less and less of what you feed them anyway.

No matter how much someone may feed them they will still see the leaves drained. That's because the plants have gone into a different mode, they change from what would be their typical way of doing things in veg and in early flower and somewhere in mid-flower they begin to alter what they do and how they do it.

Unless someone has underfed their plants the plants are not starving and will not starve. The process is something that happened over time, an evolutionary change, that assures the production of seeds in nature. If conditions turn bad near the end of flower and there would be nothing or not enough to live on in the soil seed production would suffer or possibly totally fail. You have to always remember that cannabis plants serve only one function, they only have one reason to exist ... and that is to produce seeds to perpetuate the species.

They developed a backup system where enough carbohydrates are stored that if near the end of flower conditions are not such that they can successfully finish making seeds they can and will do it on their own, by basically eating themselves, by self-flushing, if you will, by switching from the soil as their main source of moisture and nutrients to it being secondary and the plants themselves being their own primary source of 'food' and moisture thus assuring successful seed production.

Just because we grow sensimillia doesn't mean the plants will alter what they do, they will not reverse thousands of years of evolution or ignore the genetic coding of intelligent design or what Mother Nature of God or Yahweh or whoever or whatever created them and or advanced them too do. They will attempt to serve their singular purpose the way their genetics tell them to do no matter what and the above is how they attempt to do it.

 

[irieie]

Annuals, which cannabis plants are, experience an internal process triggered by light cycle changes, the shortening of days, called Senescence. An annual plant will begin to concentrate it's efforts into producing fruits and/or seed to insure future generations. This process is typically hormonally induced and begins when the light cycle begins to diminish. Eventually, under conditions related to senescence, the plant will slow photosynthesis on it's own and naturally draw nutrients from fan leaves to relocate energy into reproduction. Annual plants will essentially "flush" themselves, basically to death, all to develop healthy seed. It is a natural and predictable process.

this is great info but i was reading what this guy said in this thread which contradicts what you are saying. please help clarify. there is other info in that thread which also seem suspect...

ok, and in closing, cannabis is a tree, a perennial, not spinach, an annual. the plants hit their stride in season 2 3 4 5.. i have friends with 9 and 10 year old tree plants, football sized colas, growing up in humbolt ca.. dig out the floor in a greenhouse, 10 feet down, and the trees rise up from down to the ceiling. cannabis is not an annual and just like pinecones from ancient trees are big, buds from 2 and 3rd year old cannabis plants are profoundly richer and bigger than first year, much much denser trichome activity, hormones never subside so it's always flowering. the aforementioned big plants do 3 harvests a year. anyway, cannabis, being 349 million years older than us, has potentials very few humans fully comprehend, but we have proof than ancient dinosaurs had nostrils the size of a horse, and in that era, cannabis thrived, probably very tall trees. dinosaurs probably loved ganja more than we know and collected and distributed seeds all over the prehistoric world, i would have.
peace
joseph cecil

legal medical gardener, california

 

[Brick Top]

this is great info but i was reading what this guy said in this thread which contradicts what you are saying. please help clarify. there is other info in that thread which also seem suspect...

Originally Posted by josephcecil ok, and in closing, cannabis is a tree, a perennial, not spinach, an annual. the plants hit their stride in season 2 3 4 5.. i have friends with 9 and 10 year old tree plants, football sized colas, growing up in humbolt ca.. dig out the floor in a greenhouse, 10 feet down, and the trees rise up from down to the ceiling. cannabis is not an annual and just like pinecones from ancient trees are big, buds from 2 and 3rd year old cannabis plants are profoundly richer and bigger than first year, much much denser trichome activity, hormones never subside so it's always flowering. the aforementioned big plants do 3 harvests a year. anyway, cannabis, being 349 million years older than us, has potentials very few humans fully comprehend, but we have proof than ancient dinosaurs had nostrils the size of a horse, and in that era, cannabis thrived, probably very tall trees. dinosaurs probably loved ganja more than we know and collected and distributed seeds all over the prehistoric world, i would have.
peace
joseph cecil

Look at his first sentence and please decipher it for me, if you can. " ok, and in closing, cannabis is a tree, a perennial, not spinach, an annual."


1.) "cannabis is a tree" Cannabis is in the hops family. "The genus Cannabis was formerly placed with nettles in the family Urticaceae or with mulberries in the family Moraceae, but is now considered along with hops (Humulus sp.) to belong to the family Cannabaceae."

2.) "a perennial" Plants that live for one season and drop seeds are annuals. "An annual plant is a plant that usually germinates, flowers, and dies in a year or season. True annuals will only live longer than a year if they are prevented from setting seed." That last part does not mean growing seedless, growing sensimillia, it means not put into flowering mode to begin seed production, as in how mothers are kept, kept in a constant vegetative growth phase.

3.) "not spinach, an annual." What the heck? First he says its a perennial and then he seems to say it's an annual. What am I missing or what is he attempting to say, and what does Popeye's favorite food have to do with it?


The guy said; " cannabis is not an annual.." But what about the information below? And what about the actual definition of an annual? "An annual plant is a plant that usually germinates, flowers, and dies in a year or season. True annuals will only live longer than a year if they are prevented from setting seed." (and again, That last part does not mean growing seedless, growing sensimillia, it means not put into flowering mode to begin seed production, as in how mothers are kept, kept in a constant vegetative growth phase.)

Division: Magnoliophyta
Class: Magnoliopsida
Order: Urticales
Family: Cannabaceae
Common name: Ganja gachh, Siddi(Beng.); Indian hemp, Marijuana(Eng.).
Life cycle: Annual

http://www.bitterrootrestoration.com/annuals-plants/cannabis-sativa.html

Marijuana life expectancy

By Ed Rosenthal

How long does the marijuana plant live?
Andrew,
Internet




In nature, marijuana is an annual plant and usually lives only one season.

[FONT=Helvetica, Arial][/FONT]I do not recall the strain, or the country it was supposedly found in, but I do believe it was a Southeast Asian country, but I have read of one strain that took roughly an entire year to go from seed to harvest, but I have never heard of anything else close to it and I have never heard of any strain that flowered for years.

I have read where some believe that when the first cannabis strains evolved they were perennials but as climatic changes occurred they were forced to evolve into annuals or die out. That is only a theory that some hold, it has never been proven, and in my nearly four decades of growing I have never once heard of a single strain that will flower for years.

Of course I cannot swear to it but I believe he was telling a bit of a fib, a tall tale of sorts. If the person was telling the truth I would sure love to have a chance to read some scientific information on the strain .. and I bet if it exits the 'Dutch Masters' would have been throwing heaps and heaps of money at whoever has it so they could get their mitts on a few clones and or seeds of the strain or strains and I have not caught wind of that happening.

There is something about Cali pot people where they always have to have the most amazing pot/plants that ever existed. I have to believe this is sort of a record sized fish that got away just as it was about to be boated sort of story. I may be wrong, but since I have never heard or read anything even remotely close to what the person is claiming, and that every botanical source that can be found on cannabis clearly states it is an annual, I think the person was pulling the sites collective leg.

 

[homebrewer]

You really aren't "starving your plants the last few weeks." In an annual, like cannabis plants are, they cut back on both moisture and nutrient uptake, mainly in the last few weeks of flowering, and they basically flush themselves, they are genetically coded to use up as much stored carbohydrates as they can, so it is not as if they are being starved by someone cutting back how much they feed them because they will use less and less of what you feed them anyway.

No matter how much someone may feed them they will still see the leaves drained. That's because the plants have gone into a different mode, they change from what would be their typical way of doing things in veg and in early flower and somewhere in mid-flower they begin to alter what they do and how they do it.

Leaves change color and drop because people aren't feeding them correctly. You're correct in that their uptake slows in the last few weeks but 'slows' doesn't mean 'not eating anymore'.

 

[Brick Top]

Leaves change color and drop because people aren't feeding them correctly. You're correct in that their uptake slows in the last few weeks but 'slows' doesn't mean 'not eating anymore'.

Leaves will be drained no matter how much you feed the plants. Like I said, they are genetically coded to do it, it is a self preservation mode in case conditions turn bad and it does not need conditions to turn bad, they just do it.

And I did not say the plants would not take in anything more from the soil. I said they switch to their primary source of nutes or food and moisture to being the plant itself and the soil is secondary and by flushing you remove what is left in the soil so the plants have to rely totally on what they have stored. Basically you are creating the bad conditions that they are genetically coded to deal with.

If someone were to feed them them way is appears you are suggesting then they would be attempting to go against the plant's genetic coding to feed mainly from themselves and it would also go against the very idea of flushing.

If someone had some heavily amended soil they could easily grow multiple types of veggies and plants including cannabis in the same soil. Even with the different nutrient demands of the various plants they all thrive given the right food is in the soil. This is a perfect example of a plant choosing which and what nutrients it absorbs and when it absorbs them.

This happens because the plant is reacting with the soil microbiology. Microbes like bacteria and fungi build relationships with plants and essentially trade nutrients for carb rich substances and various fluids assisting in microbial growth. It's known as a symbiotic relationship, one relies on the other. So if an Annual plant, interacting with soil life, chooses it's own uptake, how much influence can we really have? The answer is easy, we have no influence.

In short ... plants will do what they are genetically coded to do regardless of what we attempt to do or make them do.

 

[irieie]

I may be wrong, but since I have never heard or read anything even remotely close to what the person is claiming, and that every botanical source that can be found on cannabis clearly states it is an annual, I think the person was pulling the sites collective leg.

i totally agree with you but when i read what this guy was talking about i became unsure. did you read that thread that he wrote about foliar feeding with ethanol? do you know anything about that?

 

[Brick Top]

i totally agree with you but when i read what this guy was talking about i became unsure. did you read that thread that he wrote about foliar feeding with ethanol? do you know anything about that?

Again, I may be wrong and maybe something exists I have never heard or read a single thing about, but I highly doubt it.

As for seeing his thread, no .. thankfully I missed that thread completely. Not to be too rude but he sounds like a bit of a nutter to me.

 

[Cali.Grown>408]

flushing is to make ur plant use up its remaining stored energy and to get ur ppm levels below 200 for a cleaner smoke..i've heard alot of people who flush with molasses or carbo load or anything with carbs so ur plant isnt completely starving itself..molasses is safer cuz it probably doesnt add as much ppm's as carbo load or whatever carb booster ur using..i personally flush with carbo load and molasses but very very little and for my FINAL flush i use JUST water

 

[homebrewer]

Leaves will be drained no matter how much you feed the plants. Like I said, they are genetically coded to do it, it is a self preservation mode in case conditions turn bad and it does not need conditions to turn bad, they just do it.

This is what I don't agree with and it's as simple as photosynthesis. Plants use light, water and CO2 to synthesize carbohydrates. This cannot be done without chlorophyll which of course makes plants green. Without proper nutrition, this process can slow or stop and the plant will yellow and eventually die. You're acting as if the roots one day just stop working or the plant doesn't need food which just does not happen. Maybe in an extreme case like a 12 month flower period would a plant possibly revert to some 'genetic code' and die, but at 60 or 80 days into flower, no way.

I have proof right now in my flower area that plants don't 'drain leaves no matter what I feed'. Just say the word and I'll post a pic.

How does this relate to flushing? I'm of the attitude that even in hydro, a plant has nutritional needs up to the day of harvest. If you're feeding correctly, the plant will choose what it needs and pull it up and if you deprive the plant of this during some sort of 'flushing period', then you're shorting yourself.