i used to do the same shit..guess they figured it out..no wonder when i special order i still get same lukewarm patties..i'm like fuck! how do they do it!..guess now i know
MEN: If You Work A 40-Hour Work Week..
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desert dude
Well-Known Member
Did this thread ever come to a cogent point? I admit that I didn't read past the few first posts because it nearly put me to sleep.
Sky, was there a point to your poll? Did you ever reveal it?
Sky, was there a point to your poll? Did you ever reveal it?
yes, we are getting to it..go back a page or two..
NLXSK1
Well-Known Member
The 4 items you point out have variable levels of value from pennies to hundreds of millions of dollars. You totally disregard what level of housing, food, and healthcare a person deserves.
In Obama's world a person has a right to the best healthcare with no cap on payments and it is not economicially possible to cover everyone without someone else paying for it. In the case of Obamacare it is people who are young and healthy and have no need for insurance. They have been targeted and are the ones that are supposed to pick up the bill for the people who are not producing enough to pay for their healthcare.
All that a business is required to do is compensate you for the work you do. Healthcare, pensions, etc are all BENEFITS offered so you work there. They should not be provisions of employment forced upon the employer by the government.
this is from a page or two back..
Finally - a job that will pay me what I'm worth.
Amsterdam lures alcoholics to work with beer
The New York TimesDecember 5, 2013
AMSTERDAM -- After more than a decade out of work because of a back injury and chronic alcoholism, Fred Schiphorst finally landed a job last year and is determined to keep it. He gets up at 5:30 a.m., walks his dog and then puts on a red tie, ready to clean litter from the streets of eastern Amsterdam.
"You have to look sharp," said Schiphorst, 60, a former construction worker.
His workday begins unfailingly at 9 a.m. -- with two cans of beer, a down payment on a salary paid mostly in alcohol. He gets two more cans at lunch and then another can or, if all goes smoothly, two to round off a productive day.
"I'm not proud of being an alcoholic, but I am proud to have a job again," said Schiphorst, the grateful beneficiary of an unusual government--funded program to lure alcoholics off the streets by paying them in beer to pick up trash.
In addition to beer -- the brand varies depending on which brewery offers the best price -- each member of the cleaning team gets half a packet of rolling tobacco, free lunch and 10 euros a day, or about $13.55.
The program, started last year by the Rainbow Foundation, a private but mostly government--funded organization that helps the homeless, drug addicts and alcoholics get back on their feet, is so popular that there is a long waiting list of chronic alcoholics eager to join the beer--fueled cleaning teams.
One of the project's most enthusiastic supporters is Fatima Elatik, district mayor of eastern Amsterdam. As a practicing Muslim who wears a head scarf, Elatik personally disapproves of alcohol but says she believes that alcoholics "cannot be just ostracized" and told to shape up. It is better, she said, to give them something to do and restrict their drinking to a limited amount of beer with no hard alcohol.
Conservative members of the Amsterdam City Council have derided what they call the "beer project" as a waste of government money and a misguided extension of a culture of tolerance that has already made the city a mecca for marijuana users and spawned Europe's best--known red--light district.
Hans Wijnands, the director of the Rainbow Foundation, dismissed such complaints as political grandstanding at a time when, even in the Netherlands, "it is becoming more fashionable to support repressive measures." Alarmed by what it said was a rise in crime caused by liberal drug laws, the Dutch government announced a plan in 2010 to bar foreigners from buying cannabis in so--called coffee shops, which sell marijuana and hashish legally. Amsterdam's mayor ordered city police to ignore the ban, which was supposed to go into effect nationwide this year.
The idea of providing alcoholics with beer in return for work, he said, was first tried in Canada. It took off in the Netherlands in part because the country has traditionally shunned "zero tolerance" in response to addiction. Amsterdam now has three districts running beer--for--work street cleaning programs, and a fourth discussing whether to follow suit. Other Dutch cities are looking into the idea, too.
The basic idea is to extend to alcoholics an approach first developed to help heroin addicts, who have for years been provided with free methadone, a less dangerous substitute, in a controlled environment that provides access to health workers and counselors.
"If you just say, 'Stop drinking and we will help you,' it doesn't work," said Wijnands, whose foundation gets 80 percent of its financing from the state and runs four drug consumption rooms with free needles for hardened addicts. "But if you say, 'I will give you work for a few cans of beer during the day,' they like it."
To shield the government from criticism that it is subsidizing drinking, the Rainbow Foundation insists that it pays for the beer given to Schiphorst and his fellow alcoholics out of its own funds. "For the government, it is hard to say, 'We buy beer for a particular group of people,' because other people will say, 'I would like some beer, too,'" Wijnands said.
"It would be beautiful if they all stopped drinking, but that is not our main goal," he added. "You have to give people an alternative, to show them a path other than just sitting in the park and drinking themselves to death."
The cleaning teams are forbidden from drinking while out on the street, but Schiphorst and his work mates say they get enough beer before they set out in the morning and during their lunch break to keep them going. "This is my medicine; I need it to survive," said Schiphorst, his hands shaking as he gulped his first beer of the day at a morning meeting with Rainbow Foundation supervisors.
Ramon Smits, a member of Schiphorst's team, said he used to knock back a bottle and more of whiskey or rum each day but now sticks to beer, consuming five cans a day at work and then another five or so in his free time. An immigrant from the former Dutch colony of Suriname, Smits said the project had not only helped him cut down his daily alcohol intake but also raised his self--esteem. "It keeps me away from trouble, and I'm doing something useful," he said. "I help myself, and I help my community."
Locals in the heavily immigrant eastern district who used to curse alcoholics for turning the area's main park, Oosterpark, into an unruly outdoor bar now greet them with smiles as they do their cleaning rounds, dressed in orange jackets and carrying bright yellow garbage bags.
"This is not a beer project -- it is a cleaning project," said the district mayor, Elatik, adding that it had proved far more successful in keeping drunks out of Oosterpark than previous government initiatives. On a recent afternoon, there were just three people drinking in the park, instead of the dozens who used to gather there, she said.
Until the beer--for--work program started, the authorities had tried to purge the park of drunks by banning alcohol there and stepping up patrols by security guards. But this only forced alcoholics to move to other parks in the area and led to fights with the guards. Schiphorst was detained after one such brawl.
"It is easy to say, 'Get rid of them and punish them,'" Elatik said. "But that does not solve the problem.
"Maybe I'm a softy, but I am happy to be soft if it helps people. They are human beings with problems, not just a problem to be swept away."
Schiphorst said he started drinking heavily in the 1970s after he found his wife, who was pregnant with twins, dead in their home from a drug overdose. He has since spent time in a clinic and tried other ways to quit but has never managed to entirely break his addiction.
"Every day is a struggle," he said during a lunch break with his work mates. "You may see these guys hanging around here, chatting, making jokes. But I can assure you, every man you see here carries a little backpack with their own misery in it."
http://www.adn.com/2013/12/05/3214066/amsterdam-lures-alcoholics-to.html#storylink=cpy
Amsterdam lures alcoholics to work with beer
The New York TimesDecember 5, 2013
AMSTERDAM -- After more than a decade out of work because of a back injury and chronic alcoholism, Fred Schiphorst finally landed a job last year and is determined to keep it. He gets up at 5:30 a.m., walks his dog and then puts on a red tie, ready to clean litter from the streets of eastern Amsterdam.
"You have to look sharp," said Schiphorst, 60, a former construction worker.
His workday begins unfailingly at 9 a.m. -- with two cans of beer, a down payment on a salary paid mostly in alcohol. He gets two more cans at lunch and then another can or, if all goes smoothly, two to round off a productive day.
"I'm not proud of being an alcoholic, but I am proud to have a job again," said Schiphorst, the grateful beneficiary of an unusual government--funded program to lure alcoholics off the streets by paying them in beer to pick up trash.
In addition to beer -- the brand varies depending on which brewery offers the best price -- each member of the cleaning team gets half a packet of rolling tobacco, free lunch and 10 euros a day, or about $13.55.
The program, started last year by the Rainbow Foundation, a private but mostly government--funded organization that helps the homeless, drug addicts and alcoholics get back on their feet, is so popular that there is a long waiting list of chronic alcoholics eager to join the beer--fueled cleaning teams.
One of the project's most enthusiastic supporters is Fatima Elatik, district mayor of eastern Amsterdam. As a practicing Muslim who wears a head scarf, Elatik personally disapproves of alcohol but says she believes that alcoholics "cannot be just ostracized" and told to shape up. It is better, she said, to give them something to do and restrict their drinking to a limited amount of beer with no hard alcohol.
Conservative members of the Amsterdam City Council have derided what they call the "beer project" as a waste of government money and a misguided extension of a culture of tolerance that has already made the city a mecca for marijuana users and spawned Europe's best--known red--light district.
Hans Wijnands, the director of the Rainbow Foundation, dismissed such complaints as political grandstanding at a time when, even in the Netherlands, "it is becoming more fashionable to support repressive measures." Alarmed by what it said was a rise in crime caused by liberal drug laws, the Dutch government announced a plan in 2010 to bar foreigners from buying cannabis in so--called coffee shops, which sell marijuana and hashish legally. Amsterdam's mayor ordered city police to ignore the ban, which was supposed to go into effect nationwide this year.
The idea of providing alcoholics with beer in return for work, he said, was first tried in Canada. It took off in the Netherlands in part because the country has traditionally shunned "zero tolerance" in response to addiction. Amsterdam now has three districts running beer--for--work street cleaning programs, and a fourth discussing whether to follow suit. Other Dutch cities are looking into the idea, too.
The basic idea is to extend to alcoholics an approach first developed to help heroin addicts, who have for years been provided with free methadone, a less dangerous substitute, in a controlled environment that provides access to health workers and counselors.
"If you just say, 'Stop drinking and we will help you,' it doesn't work," said Wijnands, whose foundation gets 80 percent of its financing from the state and runs four drug consumption rooms with free needles for hardened addicts. "But if you say, 'I will give you work for a few cans of beer during the day,' they like it."
To shield the government from criticism that it is subsidizing drinking, the Rainbow Foundation insists that it pays for the beer given to Schiphorst and his fellow alcoholics out of its own funds. "For the government, it is hard to say, 'We buy beer for a particular group of people,' because other people will say, 'I would like some beer, too,'" Wijnands said.
"It would be beautiful if they all stopped drinking, but that is not our main goal," he added. "You have to give people an alternative, to show them a path other than just sitting in the park and drinking themselves to death."
The cleaning teams are forbidden from drinking while out on the street, but Schiphorst and his work mates say they get enough beer before they set out in the morning and during their lunch break to keep them going. "This is my medicine; I need it to survive," said Schiphorst, his hands shaking as he gulped his first beer of the day at a morning meeting with Rainbow Foundation supervisors.
Ramon Smits, a member of Schiphorst's team, said he used to knock back a bottle and more of whiskey or rum each day but now sticks to beer, consuming five cans a day at work and then another five or so in his free time. An immigrant from the former Dutch colony of Suriname, Smits said the project had not only helped him cut down his daily alcohol intake but also raised his self--esteem. "It keeps me away from trouble, and I'm doing something useful," he said. "I help myself, and I help my community."
Locals in the heavily immigrant eastern district who used to curse alcoholics for turning the area's main park, Oosterpark, into an unruly outdoor bar now greet them with smiles as they do their cleaning rounds, dressed in orange jackets and carrying bright yellow garbage bags.
"This is not a beer project -- it is a cleaning project," said the district mayor, Elatik, adding that it had proved far more successful in keeping drunks out of Oosterpark than previous government initiatives. On a recent afternoon, there were just three people drinking in the park, instead of the dozens who used to gather there, she said.
Until the beer--for--work program started, the authorities had tried to purge the park of drunks by banning alcohol there and stepping up patrols by security guards. But this only forced alcoholics to move to other parks in the area and led to fights with the guards. Schiphorst was detained after one such brawl.
"It is easy to say, 'Get rid of them and punish them,'" Elatik said. "But that does not solve the problem.
"Maybe I'm a softy, but I am happy to be soft if it helps people. They are human beings with problems, not just a problem to be swept away."
Schiphorst said he started drinking heavily in the 1970s after he found his wife, who was pregnant with twins, dead in their home from a drug overdose. He has since spent time in a clinic and tried other ways to quit but has never managed to entirely break his addiction.
"Every day is a struggle," he said during a lunch break with his work mates. "You may see these guys hanging around here, chatting, making jokes. But I can assure you, every man you see here carries a little backpack with their own misery in it."
http://www.adn.com/2013/12/05/3214066/amsterdam-lures-alcoholics-to.html#storylink=cpy
yktind
Well-Known Member
You can make a million dollars a year and still live paycheck to paycheck. That's why sports stars and celebs go bankrupt. Living beyond your means.
Not sure if that's what they were trying to say or not.
yktind
Well-Known Member
You ever get a mini mac? lol Double cheese burger no ketchup or mustard but add lettuce and special sauce. mmmm
you don't know anything about me..
on with the show:
If we want to lessen income disparity, the solution is easy: restore the minimum wage to levels considered reasonable 43 years ago in 1969.
There is much hand-wringing about the vast income disparity in the U.S. between the top 5% and the bottom 25%, and precious little offered as a solution. Once again we are told the problem is "complex" and thus by inference, insoluble. Actually, it's easily addressed with one simple act: restore the minimum wage to its 1969 level, and adjust it for the inflation that has been officially under-reported. If you go to the Bureau of Labor Statistics Inflation Calculator and plug in $1.60 (the minimum wage in 1969 when I started working summers in high school) and select the year 1969, you find that in 2012 dollars the minimum wage should be $10 per hour if it were to match the rate considered "reasonable" 43 years ago, when the nation was significantly less wealthy and much less productive.
The current Federal minimum wage is $7.25, though states can raise it at their discretion. State rates runs from $7.25 to $8.25, with Washington state the one outlier at $9.04/hour.
In 40 years of unparalleled wealth and income creation, the U.S. minimum wage has declined by roughly a third in real terms. "Official" measures of inflation have been gamed and massaged for decades to artificially lower the rate, for a variety of reasons: to mask the destructiveness to purchasing power of Federal Reserve policy, to lower the annual cost-of-living increases to Social Security recipients, and to generally make inept politicians look more competent than reality would allow.
The full extent of this gaming is open to debate, but let's assume inflation has been under-reported by about 1% per year for the past two decades. That would suggest the minimum wage should be adjusted upward by about 20%, from $10 to $12/hour.
All those claiming such an increase will destroy the nation (or equivalent hyperbole) need to explain how the nation survived the prosperous 1960s paying the equivalent of $10-$12/hour in minimum wage. Exactly what has weakened the economy such that the lowest paid workers must bear the brunt of wage cuts?
To understand the modest scale of such an increase in the context of total household income and wealth, consider these charts. Let's start by recalling that 38 Million Workers Made Less Than $10,000 in 2010-- Equal to California's Population. (Why the Middle Class Is Doomed April 17, 2012).
There are about 140 million jobs in the U.S., including part-time and temporary, and roughly 40 million workers earn less than $10,000 a year. This is the vast population earning minimum wage, and their earnings constitute a small share of total income.
The bottom 90% have seen their wages stagnate for 40 years, but the bottom layer earning minimum wage have seen their real earnings decline by roughly one-third (not counting entitlements they might qualify for as members of the "working poor.")
In the good old days of more widely distributed incomes, the bottom 20% who generally earn minimum wage actually saw significant increases in income. That has reversed in the financialization era.
Those earning minimum wage hold a tiny sliver of the nation's wealth.
Apologists for low wages claim we must "get competitive" with low-wage nations, as global wage arbitrage has cut wages everywhere. This claim overlooks the fact that the vast majority of minimum-wage positions are precisely the jobs that cannot be outsourced: cleaning offices, fast-food jobs, pizza delivery, agricultural work, and so on.
Other apologists claim that since these positions are "low productivity," they "deserve" lower wages. If we as a nation reckoned them worthy of $10-$12/hour 40 years ago, then why are low-productivity jobs less deserving now?
Still other apologists claim that raising the minimum wage would 1) destroy small businesses and 2) trigger painful increases in food and other prices.
The only way the minimum wage can hurt small business is if some small businesses are allowed to cheat and pay illegally low wages as a way of lowering the cost of their service. If the law were uniformly and aggressively enforced, for "black market" and above-market wages alike, then those cheating their employees would slowly be eliminated from the economy via heavy fines.
Once everyone is paying $10-$12/hour, even for informal work, the "playing field" will be leveled at a higher scale.
Given the modest share of the national income earned by low-paid workers, claims that costs would skyrocket are groundless. Yes, costs would rise, but not by enough to impoverish the nation.
What all those decrying restoration of a reasonable minimum wage overlook is that the working poor will spend most of their increased wages, and that will actually aid the economy where it counts. Aren't we tired yet of Federal Reserve policies that enable more skimming by the top 1% while giving nothing to the bottom 50%? The simple, straightforward way to correct the vast income imbalances is to restore the minimum wage to 1969 levels and adjust for under-reported inflation.
What about the wealthy? Shouldn't they pay more than the rest of us? Well, actually, they already do, for the most part: the top 25% of taxpayers--34 million workers out of a workforce of 140 million--pay almost 90% of all Federal income taxes. But we'll address that aspect of income disparity tomorrow.
"Expect"
That's when I stopped reading.
If your job aint cutting it, then maybe you need more than one job. Or maybe, since you are only working 40 hours a week and combine that with your sleep hours, you still have 70+ hours a week to fucking do something about it besides complain. Learn a trade from your neighbor by riding along with them all day, your payment is what you learn that day.
You know what, fuck this, not even gonna start, better things to do.
That's when I stopped reading.
If your job aint cutting it, then maybe you need more than one job. Or maybe, since you are only working 40 hours a week and combine that with your sleep hours, you still have 70+ hours a week to fucking do something about it besides complain. Learn a trade from your neighbor by riding along with them all day, your payment is what you learn that day.
You know what, fuck this, not even gonna start, better things to do.
In recent research compiled by the New York times, it was revealed that if the “federal minimum wage had kept pace with the earnings of the richest one-percent of income earners,” the hourly minimum wage would be $22.62 and would lift tens-of-millions of Americans out of poverty. The $22.62 figure is based on the richest one-percent’s earning rate that increased 212% over the past 20 years, and is in stark contrast to the $7.25 per hour minimum that is lower than poverty wages in 1982. The outrage is that employee productivity has more than doubled since then, and it increased by 25% from 2000 to 2012 alone. The NYT report cited that if minimum wage kept pace with worker productivity, the minimum wage would have been $21.72 last year, but instead workers have watched their earnings decline as their productivity increased.
A few months ago President Obama supported a minimum wage of $10 an hour that would lift 3.8 million Americans out of poverty, and some Democrats have introduced legislation to raise the wage floor to keep pace with inflation, but the richest Americans vetoed wage hike discussions through their legislative arm the Republican Party. As usual, Republicans who are wont to claim they speak for all Americans say the people oppose higher wages, but poll after poll after survey of Americans, even Republicans, show overwhelming majorities support raising the minimum wage. Republicans have been at the forefront of legislative obstruction and inaction that resulted in inflation-adjusted minimum wage declines in both absolute and relative terms. All the while, the richest one-percent celebrated a 212% earnings increase because Republicans protect their general welfare at the expense of the workforce.
One family in the richest one percent, the Walton family (Walmart), holds more wealth than the bottom 40% of the population combined and are well aware that their 1.3 million employees are struggling to survive. To keep them in poverty but still able to work, they have left it to the taxpayers to provide $9,000 annually in food stamp and Medicaid costs for each of their underpaid employees. The nation’s largest fast food chain, McDonalds, provided their workers with a budget based on “McMinimum” wages that left no money each month for extravagances such as food or heating; they do however offer their workers assistance to apply for food stamps and Medicaid.
it seems as if these people do the same thing:
https://www.rollitup.org/politics/758123-art-popes-stores-picketed-over.html
A few months ago President Obama supported a minimum wage of $10 an hour that would lift 3.8 million Americans out of poverty, and some Democrats have introduced legislation to raise the wage floor to keep pace with inflation, but the richest Americans vetoed wage hike discussions through their legislative arm the Republican Party. As usual, Republicans who are wont to claim they speak for all Americans say the people oppose higher wages, but poll after poll after survey of Americans, even Republicans, show overwhelming majorities support raising the minimum wage. Republicans have been at the forefront of legislative obstruction and inaction that resulted in inflation-adjusted minimum wage declines in both absolute and relative terms. All the while, the richest one-percent celebrated a 212% earnings increase because Republicans protect their general welfare at the expense of the workforce.
One family in the richest one percent, the Walton family (Walmart), holds more wealth than the bottom 40% of the population combined and are well aware that their 1.3 million employees are struggling to survive. To keep them in poverty but still able to work, they have left it to the taxpayers to provide $9,000 annually in food stamp and Medicaid costs for each of their underpaid employees. The nation’s largest fast food chain, McDonalds, provided their workers with a budget based on “McMinimum” wages that left no money each month for extravagances such as food or heating; they do however offer their workers assistance to apply for food stamps and Medicaid.
it seems as if these people do the same thing:
https://www.rollitup.org/politics/758123-art-popes-stores-picketed-over.html
minimum wage = $290/week before taxes
1. shelter 31% $89.90
2. food 34.5% $100.05
3. clothes 34.5% $100.05
4. health (see doctor when sick) $75 (you would have to give up on food/clothing for that week and amount equal to prescription if "needed")
does that look about right?
1. shelter 31% $89.90
2. food 34.5% $100.05
3. clothes 34.5% $100.05
4. health (see doctor when sick) $75 (you would have to give up on food/clothing for that week and amount equal to prescription if "needed")
does that look about right?
tip top toker
Well-Known Member
290 a week and spending 100 bucks on clothes a week. Those are some fucked up priorities.
wow..i'm really sorry for you..feel better.
i split the remainder of shelter evenly for this..you can split it as you wish.
ChesusRice
Well-Known Member
On the blogs, the fight was particularly fierce. Fox PR staffers were expected to counter not just negative and even neutral blog postings but the anti-Fox comments beneath them. One former staffer recalled using twenty different aliases to post pro-Fox rants. Another had one hundred. Several employees had to acquire a cell phone thumb drive to provide a wireless broadband connection that could not be traced back to a Fox News or News Corp account. Another used an AOL dial-up connection, even in the age of widespread broadband access, on the rationale it would be harder to pinpoint its origins. Old laptops were distributed for these cyber operations. Even blogs with minor followings were reviewed to ensure no claim went unchecked. [Murdoch's World, pg. 67]
I love to cruise through the mobile home communities and look at all the beautiful cars some of these people drive. Some guy had a nice Jaguar sitting out in the rain, no one has a garage, so the cars that cost 4 times what their home did just rusts out.
It's funny, Wealthy people pretend they are poor, and poor people pretend they are rich.
tip top toker
Well-Known Member
I'd have a 2005 xkr if I took my bank up on the credit card offer they mailed me the other day. Alas I am smart enough not to resort to credit cards. If I can't afford something, I can't afford it.
desert dude
Well-Known Member
You left out death and taxes...
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