Inda-gro Induction...

PetFlora

PetFlora

Well-Known Member
Looks like you are getting double the coverage of an 8 bulb 432 w HO T5, BUT a single 420 PAR is $800, whereas a 2 X 4 T5 using more expensive aquarium bubs is roughly half that.

BUT, if the grower wants ~ > 4 X 8 then the Inda-grow seems to makes sense
 
Splifferous

Splifferous

New Member
PetFlora said:
Looks like you are getting double the coverage of an 8 bulb 432 w HO T5, BUT a single 420 PAR is $800, whereas a 2 X 4 T5 using more expensive aquarium bubs is roughly half that but only covers 2 X 4.

BUT, if the grower wants ~ > 4 X 8 then the Inda-Grow seems to make $$$ sense
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mhmm and last time i checked on replacing the bulbs in a sunblaze 48 (i used to have one), it was $120 ($15 ea, 8 of them)... and they still take 2x the electricity of a 200-PAR (cost more to run), and put out half the light (simply aren't worth the initial investment).

don't get caught up on initial start up cost of the lights alone. HID installs want stronger circuits (hire an electrician to maintain safe wiring in your house), AC units (additional upfront cost with a running expense), much more ventilation (more money)...

my entire grow is running on a single 20 amp, 120v circuit, and i never pop the breaker. the electric bill portion of my grow is about 50-60 per month. i don't need an AC unit (saved elec).

by the way, in my last run where i ran a single 420-PAR vs a 600HPS, the PAR gave over 3 times the weight, and the buds were HUGE, trichome coverage was massive. i'd run another comparison, but i'm not really seeing the point in dropping another $100 for a shitty bulb that will only last a max of 6 months. o, on that topic. if you replace that bulb 8 times, and that's $800 too. only thing is that after dropping that loot you only got 24 months of MAINTENANCE instead of a 10 year warranty on a better light source, and had a bigger per-lamp elec bill.

to me, Inda-Gro makes sense at any size grow, but makes even more sense in a larger garden.
 
PetFlora

PetFlora

Well-Known Member
Splifferous said:
mhmm and last time i checked on replacing the bulbs in a sunblaze 48 (i used to have one), it was $120 ($15 ea, 8 of them)... and they still take 2x the electricity of a 200-PAR (cost more to run), and put out half the light (simply aren't worth the initial investment).

don't get caught up on initial start up cost of the lights alone. HID installs want stronger circuits (hire an electrician to maintain safe wiring in your house), AC units (additional upfront cost with a running expense), much more ventilation (more money)...

my entire grow is running on a single 20 amp, 120v circuit, and i never pop the breaker. the electric bill portion of my grow is about 50-60 per month. i don't need an AC unit (saved elec).

by the way, in my last run where i ran a single 420-PAR vs a 600HPS, the PAR gave over 3 times the weight, and the buds were HUGE, trichome coverage was massive. i'd run another comparison, but i'm not really seeing the point in dropping another $100 for a shitty bulb that will only last a max of 6 months. o, on that topic. if you replace that bulb 8 times, and that's $800 too. only thing is that after dropping that loot you only got 24 months of MAINTENANCE instead of a 10 year warranty on a better light source, and had a bigger per-lamp elec bill.

to me, Inda-Gro makes sense at any size grow, but makes even more sense in a larger garden.
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Kinda getting lost in your reply: Are you saying a Inda Grow 200 covers a 2 X 4 foot print with the same lumens at the 4 corners as does a 432 w T5? Ditto the 420 PAR but at 4 X 8? And both bulbs last 50K hours? If the answer is yes, then Ima haf2 rethink IG
 
CharlieBud

CharlieBud

Active Member
PetFlora said:
Kinda getting lost in your reply: Are you saying a Inda Grow 200 covers a 2 X 4 foot print with the same lumens at the 4 corners as does a 432 w T5? Ditto the 420 PAR but at 4 X 8? And both bulbs last 50K hours? If the answer is yes, then Ima haf2 rethink IG
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Me thinks you grok in fullness. You can not evaluate ANY light without knowing the output, power consumption, and bulb replacement costs. For comparing to an induction light you should use a 10 year time frame, so that's 10 to 20 HPS bulbs or a TON of T5s, etc.
 
PetFlora

PetFlora

Well-Known Member
Splifferous said:
@pet: you wanna talk expensive? Compare my sunblaze 48 against my Pro-200-PAR, one year projection:

------------------- Sunblaze 48 -- Pro-200-PAR
MSRP ------------- $280 ------------- $610
annual bulb cost - $120 -------------- $0
wattage ----------- 432w ------------ 200w

after one year, the sunblaze has had a raw cost of $400, but costs more than double the electric bill as the 200-PAR. The 200-PAR puts out at least double the light intensity of the Sunblaze 48, but it's greater PAR, and the plants respond to it much better. Depending on what 1 kWh costs where you live, the one year mark may be the break even point for the 200-PAR in this comparison. It's so funny how entry price is a common topic brought up in objection to these lamps, despite the better performance over HID lighting, but those price objections come from people that would rather spend many times more money over time in the form of bulb replacement and higher electric bills. imagine the breakdown of the 420-PAR vs a 1000w HPS; 150$ bulbs every 3-6 months... LOL, and you talk expenses... I think you are addicted to buyin bulbs!

@tet1953: i agree with you. Plants have spent several millennia evolving in earth's environment to come to their current mode of functioning. As such, the indoor gardener has the opportunity to craft a custom environment for their plants, one where the light is on or off at our whim, we set the RH and temp ranges, we choose when water happens, and how nourishing the soil(medium) is for the plant. So long as we have an understanding of the cause and effect of environment variables to plant activity, we are then free to change variables in order to control what the plant does (ymmv). It's not a matter of mimicking nature indoors, it's a matter of improving upon nature indoors.
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Spliff I think I have posted later in this thread, but until I see a side-by-side grow (start to finish) with a 420 PAR v my BB using aquarium bulbs I remain skeptical. The first thing I would to see from IndaGrow is a lighted footprint of each of their units. Who wouldn"t? Next I would want to see output v my T5. Who wouldn't? Next I would want to see an electrical meter comparison. Who wouldn't? Then, I can use actual math, as opposed hypothetical math to determine the actual savings over time

RE: Mother Nature. I meant on her best day, say in a rain forest where temp, RH, and soil nutrients are ideal.
 
PetFlora

PetFlora

Well-Known Member
Buck123 said:
Now to put this Thread on the right direction as the THREAD OWNER i tell all you LED T5 FAGGOTS TOO FUCK OFF!! THIS IS ABOUT INDA-GRO NOT INDA-GRO T5'S OR INDA-GRO LEDS PLAIN AND SIMPLE!
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At the least that's an ego driven response. At worst you have some potential financial gain to protect.

You come across as though anyone reading this would not need, or want a comparison before spending their hard earned cash. FYI, these lights are not cheap throw aways

A fool and his money are soon parted. Not that the system may not prove worthy, but prove is the operative word.
 
PetFlora

PetFlora

Well-Known Member
brotherjericho said:
My biggest question is: if this technology has been around for so long, why do the lights still cost so frickin' much? That's the biggest deterrent for most when you couple the price with actual grows by non-biased sources. Sure you supposedly save in the long run, but I'm still waiting to see more than one decent grow or two before I would consider induction vs LED or other forms of fluorescent.
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Very simple: Supply and demand

Hope you all don't think me a hater, just looking for some truth/proof. I need another fixture soon. If a 420 PAR will at least double my T5 kit, within 3 grows, I'm all in! At my age I am NOT interested in a 5-10 year pay back. Keep in mid it's ALL relative. It's not ALL about you, though your point of view IS relevant! I hope you catch my point here
 
PetFlora

PetFlora

Well-Known Member
Splifferous said:
yes! time does tell!

lights come on in 2.5 hours... i'll shoot and post a new vid.

last night i made the executive decision to somewhat end my comparison run.. the HPS was being an absolute waste of light and causing the plants under it to make buds that skimp in comparison to what my dear sweet PDP is doing under the 420PAR. we ARE talking about my and my wife's meds here, and as far as i'm concerned i've seen enough to know that HPS equals insufficient; it is in my best interest now, working with what i have, to spread the shorter of my 4 out under the mover and let that HPS hobble its one plant along... that way i at least get the back half of the timetable to let the 420PAR make up for the HPS shortcomings on the ones that i know have been held back because of it's limited spectrum and waste of input energy.
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wow Wow WOW I really don't mind that you are convincing me. AND, I do appreciate your personal use interest . Keep in mind my recent replies were before reading this, but were not adversarial in any case
 
PetFlora

PetFlora

Well-Known Member
Splifferous said:
the technology as Nikola Tesla invented it in the 1890s is rather different (in applied materials and such) from how modern manufacturers apply it today. back then, they did not have ballasts capable of achieving a 2.65mHz output signal. borosilicate glass...? forget about it. you think 800$ for a lamp that is warrantied for a whole solid decade is a lot of money? thats 80$ a year. seems pretty inexpensive when compared to HID bulb costs, wouldn't you agree? did you check out that SolarStorm LED thing? friggin monstrosity with imbalanced output at almost 2 grand.. and 800w draw.

i'm sorry if you feel that my bias here is in direct regard to Inda-Gro. for your information, i'm an environmental studies major. my focus is on sustainable indoor horticulture. for 2 years, that focus was on indoor suburban food production. organic and in the home. IN the home; indoor lighting and fanatical attention to overall cost of operation, as the way i see it, huge electric bills not only buy PGE execs summer homes, but they also necessitate the installation of hydroelectric dams up and down our rivers that eff up the local watersheds and impede the seasonal movements of fish. i spent about a year researching LED and Sulfur Plasma Induction, EFDL, CMH, and LPS before i took over my own grow from my initial OMMP grower.

my first lamps for my own grow were a 200w and a 400w EFDL from a company that due to their inferior product quality i will not name here (the 400w suffered a failed ballast on month 11 from its date of manufacture - after literally 1.5 months of 18/6 and less than one month of 12/12). i will, however post a pic here of their surviving 200w vs the Inda-Gro 200PAR. the PAR is on the right with the brownish housing, but i will include incremental top-to-bottom pics so that you skeptics here can see that i'm not trying to pull anything tricky on you.

View attachment 2151443View attachment 2151444View attachment 2151445

despite the fact that these first EFDL lamps now show to be inferior to Inda-Gro EFDL, they did, none the less, demonstrate clearly that this lighting technology outperforms HID. Hence my personal choice to purchase my 200- and 420-PARs from Darryl at Inda-Gro rather than spend the 200$ on the ballast that the other company wanted to sell me to rectify the issue of their failed 400w. ya... figure that out... i'm stumped how that works for them.

but i digress.

what i am most passionate about here is a cost effective solution to the indoor cultivation of the highest quality herb possible. hands down, the electric bill is the biggest issue that all indoor pharmers have in common, and the choice of light is at the very heart of that. i am passionate about quality herb, small electric bills, paradigm shifts, and the ability of the individual to be able to do right by their own standard of measure. that's why i'm being so open with my experience with these lights. i do not work for Inda-Gro, but i am on a first name basis with Darryl. i'm not "elite" like that; he's a wonderful and very approachable guy. he's all about MMJ and power to the people, and would happily talk with any of you in regards to his products. call him and chat for yourself. i won't post his contact info here, but it's readily available on www.inda-gro.com. i do have an interest in Inda-Gro; i would love to see them grow their market share and have a national impact on changing the face on indoor gardening for the better. as their share increases, their prices will come down - all other technologies are like that. but don't get crazy with cost comparisons... if you had to fell a tree, would you choose a chainsaw or an axe? axes cost less but chainsaws do the job better, with a different technological approach to the task. i think that's a rather fair analogy for the comparison between HID and Inda-Gro. it's different. it's better.

what i do, is stand behind my high opinion of these lamps. they are amazing. this isn't about endorsing lamps because i have a commission coming my way, it's a case of love for the common man, and the want for us to be able to take control of a large portion of our monthly finances back from the utility companies. it's about my love of herb. if it's worth growing at all, it's worth growing it with the utmost passion and attention to the needs of the plant. it's about a sacred medicine, and our right to be able to provide for our own needs.

anyways, i need to get back to my BHO run. i'll check back later.

be well yall
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Keep in mind that many reading this are NOT commercial growers. Pay back is considerably longer for most of us. HOWEVER, we (I) appreciate keeping abreast of the cutting edge. I don't mind being 1-2 steps behind the cutting edge. "I" grow for personal use and gifts. The improvements/increased yield (over what I am already getting- more than enough and very high quality) are negligible. In no way construe that I mean that I think you are wasting your time. Were I younger, I would be testing as many techniques as I had room for.

Check out my journal to see my DIY approaches to simplify while maximizing quality yield
 
skorchem

skorchem

Well-Known Member
PetFlora said:
Keep in mind that many reading this are NOT commercial growers. Pay back is considerably longer for most of us. HOWEVER, we (I) appreciate keeping abreast of the cutting edge. I don't mind being 1-2 steps behind the cutting edge. "I" grow for personal use and gifts. The improvements/increased yield (over what I am already getting- more than enough and very high quality) are negligible. In no way construe that I mean that I think you are wasting your time. Were I younger, I would be testing as many techniques as I had room for.

Check out my journal to see my DIY approaches to simplify while maximizing quality yield
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That maybe true for you about not wanting quantity just quality is great and fine just keep in mind at its simplest aspect, these 420 lights are saving on electricty monthly and more so the more you use compared to 5 or 6 hids.
 
Splifferous

Splifferous

New Member
PetFlora said:
Spliff I think I have posted later in this thread, but until I see a side-by-side grow (start to finish) with a 420 PAR v my BB using aquarium bulbs I remain skeptical. The first thing I would to see from IndaGrow is a lighted footprint of each of their units. Who wouldn"t? Next I would want to see output v my T5. Who wouldn't? Next I would want to see an electrical meter comparison. Who wouldn't? Then, I can use actual math, as opposed hypothetical math to determine the actual savings over time

RE: Mother Nature. I meant on her best day, say in a rain forest where temp, RH, and soil nutrients are ideal.
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you want a side-by-side putting a 420PAR vs your aquarium lights...? sorry. i use my hard earned funds to invest in quality lighting. you want to test the worthiness of fish lights for cannabis? please, get right on that.

as far as the Sunblaze 48 vs Inda-Gro, i can try to help a bit via pictures. remember that i got rid of my 48, so i had to find an old picture of when i was running it.

here is is in a closet, all 432 watts at about 3 ft from the ground. (and the sunflowers on the left are within inches of the tubes)
IMG_20120316_004623.jpg


and here is a new pic, just took it, of one of my 420s over 5 girls in 7gal pots. this lamp is 12 watts LESS than that P.O.S. T5, is about 5.5 feet from the ground, and is the sole light source in this picture. the canopy is about 2 and a half feet below the lamp.
IMG_20120627_040737.jpg

i know its not the ideal way to compare, but hopefully you can at least get the gist of the MASSIVE difference in light output.

and in closing, here's a pic to try to convey my support of these lamps. they are absolutely the best horticultural lighting, aside from the sun itself. sure they have a bit of a start up investment, but then... so do most things that are worth it. perhaps you have noticed that trend when comparing steak vs McDonalds, or Audi vs. Honda.
IMG_20120616_060402.jpg
 
PetFlora

PetFlora

Well-Known Member
Spliff: My comparison comments are directed to Inda-Grow, not any RIU members. Of course you would not do that.
 
Splifferous

Splifferous

New Member
PetFlora said:
Spliff: My comparison comments are directed to Inda-Grow, not any RIU members. Of course you would not do that.
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of my entire response to you, this is all you have to reply with?

were you able to see anything of note in the pictures that i dug out and posted for you? did you even look at them?

please don't take anything i type personally, especially at odd hours.. i have 3 herniated discs between t6 and t9, and i live with a chronic pain in the middle of my back. it's just that i've had more than my fair share of ignorant naysayers that come in and try to hijack a thread where i am trying to help others by sharing knowledge where all they do is talk about their ignorance and how they want others to show them the right way (but they never read back in the thread to where the answers are for the questions that they are about to post)... how you show up now and start blowing up the thread is giving me flashbacks of BJ. but that's probably just me and the fact that i have been averaging 3 agonizing hours of sleep per night for the past week and a half. sleep deprivation is no fun.

and for what it's worth, talking with me as almost as good as talking with Inda-Gro directly; i'm now an authorized rep for them. my willingness to take a personal and unpaid involvement in spreading the word about their amazing lamps has earned me the recognition of their president and ceo.

i realize that by me being up front and sharing this information with you all will most likely result in some of the above mentioned types crying about my words no longer being unbiased, but whatever. like i have said before, i care most about the quality of the medicine that i grow for my wife and i. Darryl at IG is the man. an absolutely amazing person that stands behind his products, as well as the medical cannabis movement. so many companies that stock the shelves of my local hydro shop won't talk about cannabis cultivation, but will toss you a nudge and a wink when they tell you about the "tomatoes" that you can grow with their products. that's just bullshit marketing, imo. you wanna sell me something to grow my herb with? tell the world and the government that its something for growing herb, not tomatoes. i knew there was something very endearing about this man and his company the first (and second, and third, etc...) time i saw his face and heard his voice talking about his products, calling out his personal name and company name, standing and filming a youtube video in a medical cannabis garden, or at various SoCal cannabis related events. this man is passionate and an activist. something that i, myself, feel in regards to not only cannabis, but also responsible use of our planet's resources. and that's yet another common thread between he and i.

o, and in case you missed it, please read this wikipedia page (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phoebus_cartel), and then if you have the time and desire, follow a few of the company-related links. GE, Phillips, Osram are terribad companies. for a century now (give or take) they have been profiteering off of obsolete technologies while suppressing the release of advanced lighting solutions. EFDL was invented in 1891 by Nikola Tesla. that should be a case of "nuff said". but we both know that it's so, and it's a long way to the point of understanding without hard feelings, so for now, just content yourself to find out a little more about the mindset of the company that bends you over with no Vaseline every time you go to the store to buy a new bulb.

anyways.. i need to get ready for the day. the suns coming up and i need to get the ladies out for their early morning foliars. today is gonna be hella busy, and hopefully tonight will see a new video update.

take care everyone.
 
PetFlora

PetFlora

Well-Known Member
Sorry to hear about the chronic pain!

FYI I have read every page.


Yep read every word, looked carefully at every picture. Not here to be a hater, just asking pointed questions in hopes of avoiding an expensive mistake

Everything looks good, but honestly, no better than my 8 bulb T5 (I have a journal on riu with lots of pics, now ~ 3 weeks from harvest), however, I can only get 2 large plants under mine. I do appreciate the cost of replacement HO T5s being ~ $200/yr, but at my age, I would likely be dead before I hit the half life of the IG bulb, but will still spend ~ $1000 on bulbs alone.

I remain intrigued. Awaiting near harvest close up photos

I personally have no problem with your connection to Inda-Grow, but since you have their ear, providing the info I suggested on their website could only help sales.
 
skorchem

skorchem

Well-Known Member

  • Splifferous do me a favor please and let me know if these 420pars will work in the UK (England) I want to buy one in september and if so would you be able to find out the total price including shipping ?



 
PetFlora

PetFlora

Well-Known Member
I'm still looking for my next light. Been leaning toward an Inda-Grow, until I read this. Can somebody elaborate, put it in lay people perspective?


I don't think i`d want to be spending a lot of time in the near field of what is effectively a 2.65mhz transmitter/antenna operating at several hundred watts :wink:
 
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