The thing is... they already have laws making going into my home uninvited illegal, taking my things illegal, Trespassing on my property illegal...felonies too.
Yet you think another law will deter them further?
Mass Murder by Blade, you Vast Idiots
- Thread starter Doer
- Start date
Yet you think another law will deter them further?
Beefbisquit
Well-Known Member
I don't think a law about storage specifically will deter criminals, I think the measures people will take to store them will prevent criminals from stealing them.
Derp.
Wait, you think a law that makes it illegal to not have a firearm safely stored away so that no thief/burglar/heavy equipment operator on a rampage can gain access to a firearm isn't somehow a deterrent to firearm thieves? I totally agree. Criminals don't give a shit about laws, and no gun vault can keep out a good thief. I appreciate you finally ceding that point.
If you knew the bank had no cash, would you rob it anyway?
Besides, no way would your little fantasy be in any way shape or form enforceable. It would be like having a law that says its illegal to fuck your wife in the mouth.
budleydoright
Well-Known Member
Beefbisquit
Well-Known Member
The law isn't the deterrent the safe is. A good safe is a) hard to move b) hard to access. So is a lock box secured to a wall. Most robberies aren't done 'oceans 11' style regardless of what you might think. Your arguments are pretty comical, you're trying to put words in my mouth.
I didn't say that. I think a gun vault will keep out most thieves. Even if they only stopped 1/2 of gun thefts, that would be 125,000 illegal guns out of the hands of thieves, each year.
It would be enforceable after the fact. Not to mention, one of you, and your fellows, key arguments is that people are law abiding citizens for the most part. How do various other nations have similar laws, and they seem to find ways to enforce them that don't involve inspections and visits from LEO.
Who is going to pay for the gun vault?
Lets say you stepped out to your neighbors house for 5 minutes, and you got robbed at that time and the thief got your Ma Duece .50 that you keep on the night stand. The thief then kills a few dozen people with it the next day, the cops find the gun, but with no way to trace it back to you, just say it was a stolen gun and put it into evidence.
What now?
Beefbisquit
Well-Known Member
If you aren't a lawful citizen, you won't report it stolen.
If you're a lawful citizen, you will report it stolen.
Which are you? Do you follow the laws or don't you?
Doer
Well-Known Member
I'm surely that hot. I'm known to be that crazy. You of all people don't need to lavish me with compliments but I do appraciate it.yep.
to be this crazy Doer must be at least this hot:
Beef when you are saying something different but you never say what that is, well....you call me incomprehensible??
- Well, I can't help what is on the books in your jurisdiction. I'm suggesting something different.
- Not sure about any existing laws of this nature. I can certainly imagine one, I've already listed several ideas for one.
NO. Give me ANYTHING
You know "Get past Saves," is not going to happen. Saves are at least 5 x, the harm of guns.
The 2nd Amendment is only about the SAVES.
Beefbisquit
Well-Known Member
I'm surely that hot. I'm known to be that crazy. You of all people don't need to lavish me with compliments but I do appraciate it.
Beef when you are saying something different but you never say what that is, well....you call me incomprehensible??
- Well, I can't help what is on the books in your jurisdiction. I'm suggesting something different.
- Not sure about any existing laws of this nature. I can certainly imagine one, I've already listed several ideas for one.
NO. Give me ANYTHING
I'm not going to bother typing the same shit I've already posted. If you can't be bothered to read it, or didn't understand what I wrote, that's your problem. I, almost always, use proper grammar, punctuation, and syntax, so if you're having difficulties, I'm not willing to hold your hand.
Zero basis for this statement other than your imagination.
WEEDING CUMPPWEHENSHUN.
Go back through the thread, little one. I've provided possibilities, and ideas. I haven't provided a complete solution because I don't have one. Never claimed to, only showing how it's relatively easy to reduce the access criminals have to firearms, without reducing the capacity for a citizen to protect themselves.
You, on the other hand, have pulled your pants down, started shitting all over the place, with your fingers in your ears, yelling at the top of your lungs "I DON'T WANNA", like a giant baby.
We've got NoBrain trying to find every argument from absurdity he can to debase my ideas, and when he can't, he just makes up a strawman and acts like he's either a) won the debate or b) contributed something worthwhile. Then there's The Rockodile Hunter, who claims rocks are deadlier than guns, and that even though I've stated positions regarding when locks, etc should/could be used, what classifies as a readied firearm, and some other points, he says I haven't provided ideas about the types of laws that could help curb the stolen firearm rate in the USA.
Beefbisquit
Well-Known Member
If a firearm is in your house or on your property and you (or another gun owner) are not, it needs to be stored.
Already said this, a bunch of times.
There is no point to a gun being readied and left unattended, when there's no one in the home to use it. There is no benefit to this scenario, but to criminals who can steal your firearm.
Likewise, there's no point to having a gun for protection if it needs to be stored when you're home. There is also no benefit to this scenario, but to criminals who would have the upper hand on you if they decide to invade your home.
Beefbisquit
Well-Known Member
Laws prevent some people from becoming criminals. You can't seriously be this retarded....can you?
Some people don't steal, not because of their moral standing, but because they don't want to go to jail. Some people might get mad enough to kill someone, but they don't because they don't want to go to jail. The forfeiture of their rights in order to perform an illegal action is enough to stop most people from performing said action.
You have got to be the dumbest and most ignorant person I've ever had a conversation with. This is basic sociology, something you're not familiar with..... obviously.
Jails exist for deterrence, rehabilitation (LOL), incarceration, and retribution. Laws, are also a form of deterrence; 99% of people don't want to go to jail.
Your argument has this tendency to rely on the fact that most citizens aren't criminals, yet you say gun locks would have no effect..... If there was a law enforcing storage reg's, by your own argument, most people would follow the law as most people aren't criminals. The law wouldn't be in place to have criminals legally store their illegal firearms, the law would be in place to get lawful citizens to store their firearms so criminals, that are going to steal regardless of laws, cannot access their firearms without at the very least, working for it.
kelly4
Well-Known Member
If I own the gun and I own the house...I will store my gun as I like.
I like how you blame the gun owner...not the home invader.
Doer
Well-Known Member
It is simple question you cannot even answer.
What is a single suggestion of any gun law, that can make the distinction between a gun that is stored and a gun that ready.
Do you think there is any gun restriction device law that can exempt a gun that is ready for home use?
If so, how can it exempt? What is your suggestion?
I know you think it is fun to tap dance around. Your fun is not my point.
What is a single suggestion of any gun law, that can make the distinction between a gun that is stored and a gun that ready.
Do you think there is any gun restriction device law that can exempt a gun that is ready for home use?
If so, how can it exempt? What is your suggestion?
I know you think it is fun to tap dance around. Your fun is not my point.
Beefbisquit
Well-Known Member
I've alreayd made the distinction between a stored and readied firearm. You're asking the same retarded question over and over again, when I've answered multiple times.Is this a game?
Exempt a gun that is ready for home use? What does that even mean? Exempt it from what, the law? You don't even make any sense, is that supposed to be a complete sentence?
Exempt from what? Suggestion regarding the exemption of a firearm from what?
The distinction between a firearm that's readied and stored;
Stored;
Stored in a safe, lock-box, or has a trigger guard, or has been rendered inoperable via removal of the bolt/slide/upper/lower receiver. (Part of the firearm should still be locked up somehow, not sure of the exact wording I'd use)
When would a firearm need to be stored;
When you're not at your residence, or on the property of your residence, where your firearm(s) are located.
Readied;
Anything other than stored. Loaded, unloaded, cocked, safety on/off, your choice.
When can you keep a readied firearm?
When you're in your residence, or on the property of your residence, where your firearm(s) are located.
I'm sure there would be much more to it, I'm not a law maker - and it would have to be thought through very carefully.
Beefbisquit
Well-Known Member
Is it locked? Or made inoperable? If not, then it's pretty fucking simple - no, it's not stored. It's a firearm that's been left unsecured.
There isn't currently one in the USA, you mean. It doesn't mean a law couldn't be created to allow for a ready 'exemption' as you put it. It's not really an exemption if the law is created new, from scratch.
Also, it's an exemption if you have a current law that forbids readied guns, then a new law is created to overturn it. Creating a new law, ground up that allows for readied guns, would not, by definition be an exemption to the rule, as the rule would never have forbid it in the first place.
The rule could simply state;
When an operator is not present in the residence or on the property of the residence, storage laws must be followed.
I guess it's kind of making an exception, not really an exemption.
Beefbisquit
Well-Known Member
Because people like you are opposed to good sense.