McDonald's Guide to Living on Minimum Wage

UncleBuck said:

i don't see tuition or books anywhere in that budget.

you'd have to work for 10 months just to afford books for one semester out of your (imaginary) savings.

Click to expand...

You can apply for grants. Do work study. Etc. My grand father at 18 got kicked out of home, in the reserves, drove a taxi and still graduated suma cum laude. And took my grand mother on dates. Sometimes you have to do shit even though it sucks. Such is life.

grebal said:

Hopefully anyone not a teen, a dropout, or the infirm, etc. aspires to greater things than a lifetime or a career at McDs.

And for those who *do* choose a career, min. wage is a floor, a starting level, not a cap, and managers and GMs make a good deal more than min wage.

Funny that a bunch of mexican immigrants (legal or otherwise) can so far outshine american youth. No, not funny. What's the word. Right. Telling.

Click to expand...

i have a neighbor who is no slouch, he can fix damn near anything. he has worked in maintenance and security positions all his life and is about 60 years old.

he makes $13 an hour, and good luck convincing him that there is a much better wage out there if he just tries harder. he's the type that won't half ass it or call into work even when he's sick.

getting a raise at walmart from $7.25 to $8.00 is not the magical answer to the problem.

Canna Sylvan said:

You can apply for grants. Do work study. Etc. My grand father at 18 got kicked out of home, in the reserves, drove a taxi and still graduated suma cum laude. And took my grand mother on dates. Sometimes you have to do shit even though it sucks. Such is life.

Click to expand...

you can get grants, but good luck making ends meet on minimum wage working 70 hours a week while trying to excel in community college, much less an actual university.

to me, the point isn't about whether or not someone aspires to something better than minimum wage. that falls apart once you address the fact that SOMEONE has to flip the burgers and scrub the toilets and stock the shelves and thread the screws. it's not like the entire minimum wage workforce can just wake up tomorrow and go get a better job. there are only so many "better jobs" and there is too much unskilled labor to be done in the meantime. the country would burn down overnight if that happened.

the alternative is to pay people better and force companies to make up the costs by charging consumers higher prices. if that happened, the next tier of workers becomes the new working poor because their spending abilities are now no better than last week's minimum wage workers because shit just got expensive. everyone goes down a notch and the minimum wage workers still can't afford a better quality of life. there's not much point to that plan.

another alternative is to raise taxes to fund social service programs like foodstamps and rent vouchers and whatnot. while that has the potential to be somewhat fair on paper, the reality is that it would be implemented shoddily and mismanaged to hell. i personally don't mind paying more in taxes if i feel like there's a good reason for it, but i can recall at least 6 scandals in the past 7 years in my state alone that happened because the people running the show are too stupid, proud, and pussy to keep proper tabs on the money. the most recent scandal involved over a thousand dead people collecting ebt benefits, people using multiple social security numbers, and carrying balances of several thousand dollars of cash benefits. the best part is that the "state auditor" makes a salary of 125k a year and the office itself has a budget of over 17 million. i don't agree with taking more of my money when they can't even manage what they already have.

but as for the minimum wage workers themselves, not all of them are too lazy to find something better. sometimes something better isn't there, and even if it was, there's still crappy jobs that still need to be done. not everyone had parents who pushed them in school, not everyone went to college and got a degree, not everyone can decide to go to college on a whim to better their situation as an adult, and not everyone gets the life they planned on. someone needs to do that work, and i don't see any point in mocking the people who end up with shit jobs. it's not funny that people working 70 hours a week at ANY types of jobs can't afford to do anything but work, eat ramen, and sleep.

Total Head said:

the alternative is to pay people better and force companies to make up the costs by charging consumers higher prices. if that happened, the next tier of workers becomes the new working poor because their spending abilities are now no better than last week's minimum wage workers because shit just got expensive. everyone goes down a notch and the minimum wage workers still can't afford a better quality of life. there's not much point to that plan.

Click to expand...

dissenting opinion.

adjusted for inflation, minimum wage used to be much higher than it is today, and that was back when america was in its heyday. since then, starting at about the time of the reagan revolution, we started giving tax breaks to the top and minimum wage, adjusted for inflation, started its fall to where it is today.

history shows that everyone does better, even those at the top, when we spread the wealth more equitably.

there is an old saying about that, along the lines of: 'the money always ends up at the top, because those at the top are the best at getting it. but at least it goes through the hands of those at the bottom first'.

in our nation where aggregate demand accounts for 70% of the economy, it makes no sense to send the money to the top and hope it trickles down, it makes much more sense to start from the bottom and watch the money naturally get vacuumed up.

Canna Sylvan said:

I have a mild form of autism. Its both a learning disorder and neuro difference. You cant drug me into thinking like a neuro typical. Just like no drug in the world will fix your terrible grammar from a deficient left brain.

Click to expand...

I do believe this is the best insult I have ever heard in my life.

• You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to Canna Sylvan again.
  
  
  
  

UncleBuck said:

dissenting opinion.

history shows that everyone does better, even those at the top, when we spread the wealth more equitably.

there is an old saying about that, along the lines of: 'the money always ends up at the top, because those at the top are the best at getting it. but at least it goes through the hands of those at the bottom first'.

in our nation where aggregate demand accounts for 70% of the economy, it makes no sense to send the money to the top and hope it trickles down, it makes much more sense to start from the bottom and watch the money naturally get vacuumed up.

Click to expand...

Where in history does the 'spread the wealth' show that we all do better? (China? Russia?)

A bit confused: If the $ goes through the hands of the bottom first.
How does the 'top' ascertain it immediately?

Seems the bottom should be more coy to making decisions.
It's why the guys at the top, are at the top.

Rush Limbaugh used to say "you are as smart as your paycheck".

Nutes and Nugs said:

Where in history does the 'spread the wealth' show that we all do better? (China? Russia?)

Click to expand...

you forgot my addendum, "more equitably". not 100% equitably, not USSR equitably, but more equitably than we currently do.

history shows that we all do better that way, even those at the top.

Nutes and Nugs said:

A bit confused: If the $ goes through the hands of the bottom first.
How does the 'top' ascertain it immediately?

Seems the bottom should be more coy to making decisions.

Click to expand...

i never said the top ascertain it immediately, nor that those on the bottom are making decisions that are not so coy.

the point is that it goes through their hands first, rather than those of a select few.

the people get to spend it the way they want, whether that be on community college tuition or beer and firecrackers. after all, the money will always be spent wiser by the taxpayer rather than the government, says every low tax advocate ever.

furthermore, since money is power, a more equitable spread of the wealth also means that the power is more decentralized. that should satisfy anyone who wants looser gun laws for the exact same reason, decentralization of power.

Nutes and Nugs said:

It's why the guys at the top, are at the top.

Click to expand...

LOL!

the top is at the top for a lot of reasons, and very often not because they deserve to be. there are lots of ways to come into money, whether through inheritance, or marriage, or illegal means.

you don't have to be vanderbilt to make some hay.

Nutes and Nugs said:

Rush Limbaugh used to say "you are as smart as your paycheck".

Click to expand...

damn, rush limbaugh just destroyed my belief in good will hunting. but not reality.

best of luck following rush limbaugh, dumbass.

UncleBuck said:

best of luck following rush limbaugh, dumbass.

Click to expand...

I was thinking that exact same thing. Just trying to post it a little more delicately.

• You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to UncleBuck again.
  
  
  
  

The entire school loan system is about to collapse in 3 to 5 years. I stopped paying mine because I can't afford to - I owe $100,000 + in school loans, am partially disabled, and will seemingly live the remainder of my life in debt. Bankruptcy will not remove these debts.

When the global economy collapses around this debt, the modern capitalist system is in for a major overhaul.

Student loan debt tops $1 trillion
All student loan debt, which includes private loans from banks as well as the federal loans, now stands at $1.2 trillion.
http://www.politico.com/story/2013/07/student-loan-debt-tops-1-trillion-94316.html

UncleBuck said:

notably absent: food, gasoline, heating, and an accurate health insurance number.

so as long as you don't mind being cold, hungry, sick, and paying for a car that has no fuel to run (all while working about 70 hours a week at two jobs), it's totally doable.

Click to expand...

when was this guide made, 1982?...forget heat right? who the fuck needs eat, i personally love hypothermia and freezing to death. thats just me. id also love to see a car payment at 150 or health insurance for 20 bucks


this is perfect, all you have todo is work 2 full time min, wage jobs, 80 hours a week, yea!!!


welcome to 'merika!

buck, when wasthis made and or when did u find it/ how did u find it?

joe macclennan said:

I was thinking that exact same thing. Just trying to post it a little more delicately.

Click to expand...

LOL, I'm not 'following' Rush Limbaugh.
Just a quote I used to hate but finding it more true.

cannabineer said:

I was darkly amused by what i consider hallucinatory lowball rent. Where you are, is such a rent realistic? cn

Click to expand...

breleive it or not, 600 per month rent is normal where i live, u can even find 1or 2 bedrooms for 450-500,it used to be alot cheaper until the domestic oil expansion in the usa, now adays dudes come from texas to where i am and get paid 4times the money ppl do here, so everyone raised the rent up to an avg of about 850-1000 per month, when right before they came in avg rent was below 700, just another example how oil companies come into an area and tear it the fuck apart, culturally, economically and most importantly environmentally, everyone sold their land to the oil companies for barley any money, fuckin sell out for the almighty dollar, but then in 15 years when there is no more gas/oil coming out of the ground where i live, they will all pack up their shit and leave behind nothing but a huge mess for the locals to clean up. i know people in my area no far from me where they can litrally light the water coming out of the faucet on first because of all the fracking fluid and sulfur and methane being released from fracking. its pretty fucked up if u ask me and should be illegal

UncleBuck said:

you forgot my addendum, "more equitably". not 100% equitably, not USSR equitably, but more equitably than we currently do.

history shows that we all do better that way, even those at the top.

Click to expand...

So what is this "history" you speak of? Its a cool word you've been using, but have yet to back up with anything of substance. We all want real examples.

UncleBuck said:

you're living on food stamps and used to steal from your parents to buy heroin. so what would that make you?

Click to expand...

the government?

Dr. Mary Ruart has an excellent book that explains how a forced minimum wage law hurts poor people in the long run. I highly recommend it.


[h=3]Official Site of Dr. Mary Ruwart — Author of Healing Our World[/h]www.ruwart.com/‎

Anyone with a bit of sense understands that forced minimum wage is bad. People should be paid for the worth of their services. If your service is worth $5/hr, then that is what you should be paid. Likewise $50/hr.

When you force a minimum wage, you then force employers to pass on the costs of paying people more than their services might be worth. The increased costs then end up hurting the very people they are supposed to help. Its all very basic economics.

UncleBuck said:

i don't see tuition or books anywhere in that budget.

Click to expand...

who pays for those things out of pocket? Today kids get an automatically accepted loan for up to $250,000 for school. Some of that money can be used to buy a car, apartment, fuel etc etc. then just push off paying the loan back until the very last minute that you can, hopefully you can then die from old age and stick the bill with the tax payers.

Julius Caesar said:

The entire school loan system is about to collapse in 3 to 5 years. I stopped paying mine because I can't afford to - I owe $100,000 + in school loans, am partially disabled, and will seemingly live the remainder of my life in debt. Bankruptcy will not remove these debts.

When the global economy collapses around this debt, the modern capitalist system is in for a major overhaul.

Student loan debt tops $1 trillion
All student loan debt, which includes private loans from banks as well as the federal loans, now stands at $1.2 trillion.
http://www.politico.com/story/2013/07/student-loan-debt-tops-1-trillion-94316.html

Click to expand...

What? Your education didn't land you in a high paying job??????? Hillary promised that you would all be middle class if only you went to college.

UncleBuck said:

dissenting opinion.

adjusted for inflation, minimum wage used to be much higher than it is today, and that was back when america was in its heyday. since then, starting at about the time of the reagan revolution, we started giving tax breaks to the top and minimum wage, adjusted for inflation, started its fall to where it is today.

history shows that everyone does better, even those at the top, when we spread the wealth more equitably.

there is an old saying about that, along the lines of: 'the money always ends up at the top, because those at the top are the best at getting it. but at least it goes through the hands of those at the bottom first'.

in our nation where aggregate demand accounts for 70% of the economy, it makes no sense to send the money to the top and hope it trickles down, it makes much more sense to start from the bottom and watch the money naturally get vacuumed up.

Click to expand...

The globalizers and their banker buddies ripped the guts out of that model. I wonder if the trend toward lower marginal tax rates coincided with the top 0.x% deciding that they were finally winning at Monopoly. cn