More on Moore's "Sicko."

ViRedd said:
Uhhh ... but you guys have made no mention of increasing competition in the medical industry. How come? Fierce competition is the natural leveling field for prices. Did you know that the amount of new M.D.'s graduating from college is artifically contolled to limit the numbers? Also, you must take into account how many people stiff the hospital on their bills. The cost of running a good hospital entails much more than just the nurse's salary. I think I read somewhere that a new MRI machine costs in excess of two millon dollars as an example.

Vi
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Here's the deal, VI: Competition is taught to every American from an early age, baseball, football etc. That concept is OK for sports. It's when it ends up in the real world, things get complicated. For example If there is competition for an job, one sperson wins and one oerson loses. The very Idea of winning is a reprehensible concept. What about the second place entity. That sends a message of failure to the whole side, the losing side There should be no winning and losing sides in life, there should only be life. People helping people to succeed, be what they can be, not "I've got mine, fuck you" Untill man gets his head around that concept, we'll have selfish pricks that only want what is good for them and fuck you. Does that sound familiar to you,~LOL~.
 
ViRedd said:
Uhhh ... but you guys have made no mention of increasing competition in the medical industry. How come? Fierce competition is the natural leveling field for prices. Did you know that the amount of new M.D.'s graduating from college is artifically contolled to limit the numbers? Also, you must take into account how many people stiff the hospital on their bills. The cost of running a good hospital entails much more than just the nurse's salary. I think I read somewhere that a new MRI machine costs in excess of two millon dollars as an example.

Vi
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I don't know what parallel universe your living in, but where is this supposed competition in the medical industry that you speak of?
(me thinks he doth talk out his ass)
Most in the industry are trying to see who can out do each other to see who can come up with the Highest price.
Go to the doctor with a sprained ankle and they will charge you at least $35.00 for an ace bandage... (the Very same Ace Bandage that you can buy in the store for $3.50) That is a 1,000% profit margin.
Also you speak of how people stiff the Hospital?
No the Hospital prices themselves out of the market, so people can ill afford to pay it. I just looked up the Price of MRI Machines and there are some models that are 2 Million, but most are around 1.2 million and the Operating cost of an MRI per Year to run the MRI Machine is $80,000...

Average Charge for the Use of a MRI Machine.
This is what they charge to put you in an MRI and run it.
Health Care Cost Estimator
  • Magnetic Resonance Imaging (MRI) - in Hospital - $1,794
  • Magnetic Resonance Imaging (MRI) - in Doctor's Office - $1,358
  • CT Scan (Computed Tomography) - in Hospital - $1,186
  • CT Scan (Computed Tomography) - in Doctor's Office - $722

Now it may take a little while for them to recoup the cost of the initial purchase but most hospitals recoup the operating cost with a month.
The Only reason that the Operating cost of a hospital is so high is because they greatly inflate them so that they can satisfy the share holders and the board of directors. But if you must know, it cost about 28 million to run the average hospital (average hospital being a hospital like Greater El Monte, in the San Gabriel Valley of California) Most rural hospitals cost about 5 -10 Million to run per year depending how busy they are. I live right around the corner from a rural hospital.

Who are you trying to bullshit Vi? Do you think that your the only person who researches this stuff? I'm betting that you listened to Ronald Reagan's record on Socialism back in the 50's didn't you?
 
:roll:
medicineman said:
Here's the deal, VI: Competition is taught to every American from an early age, baseball, football etc. That concept is OK for sports. It's when it ends up in the real world, things get complicated. For example If there is competition for an job, one sperson wins and one oerson loses. The very Idea of winning is a reprehensible concept. What about the second place entity. That sends a message of failure to the whole side, the losing side There should be no winning and losing sides in life, there should only be life. People helping people to succeed, be what they can be, not "I've got mine, fuck you" Untill man gets his head around that concept, we'll have selfish pricks that only want what is good for them and fuck you. Does that sound familiar to you,~LOL~.
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Oh, my GAWD! I can't believe you wrote that Med ... and I certainly find it very hard to believe that you actually believe what you wrote.

Hey, Gumba-ya brother, Gumba-ya. *lol* TieDye and Birkenstocks forever! :roll:

Vi
 
Dank sez ...

"Who are you trying to bullshit Vi? Do you think that your the only person who researches this stuff? I'm betting that you listened to Ronald Reagan's record on Socialism back in the 50's didn't you?"

Remember when I said that I had a serious surgery while uninsured? Well, I worked out terms with the hospital. How was I able to do that? Well, at the time, we had two hospitals in town. I approached the first one as asked them if they would work out terms. They said yes and gave me the terms. I then went to the other hospital and approached them as said: "Hey, this is what the other hospital will do, can you beat their terms? They said yes and gave me better terms. Then I went back to the first hospital an told them that the second hospital beat the hell out of their terms and could they do any better? They made me an offer I couldn't refuse, not just on initial payment and monthly payments, but on the room cost as well.

Competition is the life-blood of the free market. When government stiffles competition through over-regulation, prices go up, not down.

And by the way, why are you buying Ace bandages from your doctor? Hell man, I'd ask mine to throw it in for free. *lol*

Vi
 
ViRedd said:
:roll:

Oh, my GAWD! I can't believe you wrote that Med ... and I certainly find it very hard to believe that you actually believe what you wrote.

Hey, Gumba-ya brother, Gumba-ya. *lol* TieDye and Birkenstocks forever! :roll:

Vi
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Well Believe it "brother" for that is what Jesus Had in mind and if you're "all that Christian", then this is the path, not the one you're on. It is the same path promoted By Jesus, Budda, mohammed, Gandi, all the great seers. Don't get me wrong here, I realize man is far from this, and it will take Divine intervention, or atomic warfare to thin man out into tribal pockets, But it does exist in the jungles of south America in some tribes to some extent. Where the welfare of the people, or tribe in this instance is more important than the selfness of the individual. Mans priorities are all askewed. The first priority is to God, not mammon. Hey, I can't live like that and I know you can't either, but that is the preferred path. Jesus never preached competition will make a better world, He preached Love one another, He never said "It's better to kick someones ass than try and get along", these are Mans doings. I'm just stating facts, no need to go balistic. I realize you live in a very selfish space and just wanted you to see that selfishness is the opposite of Godliness. So take heed my "brother", Maybe there is a hell after earth., some less fortunate believe this is it. If you lived in Iraq, you might suspect this was hell.
 
I also believe that one of the most important religious tenents is: Thou Shalt Not Steal. Wasn't Moses carrying around some slates that ha something similar imprinted on them? I think they mentioned something about coveting too. :)

Vi
 
It says “Give unto God, what is God's and Render unto Caesar what is Caesar's.”

That means pay tithes at church and PAY YOUR TAXES TO THE GOVERNMENT!!! Biblically you are wrong. Taxes have been around for thousands of years, get used to it.
Vi you will never win an argument with me by using the bible, my mother is a Licensed minister and I have had the bible pounded into my head since I was 7 years old... I more than likely know the bible better than you do.
 
Dankdude said:
It says “Give unto God, what is God's and Render unto Caesar what is Caesar's.”

That means pay tithes at church and PAY YOUR TAXES TO THE GOVERNMENT!!! Biblically you are wrong. Taxes have been around for thousands of years, get used to it.
Vi you will never win an argument with me by using the bible, my mother is a Licensed minister and I have had the bible pounded into my head since I was 7 years old... I more than likely know the bible better than you do.
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Dankster ...

I'm not against taxes. I'm against our taxing METHODS.

You are quoting Mark 12:17 there Dank. There is nothing in the bible that supports a progressive income tax. Here's an essay to explain. Hope you get a kick out of it. :)

http://taxprof.typepad.com/taxprof_blog/files/2005-17601-1.pdf

Vi
 
Looks like most popular of "Gods" tax plans was a progressive income tax, the exact tax you hate so much. "Those who have more should do more", Now if that was in fact a response of the rich, maybe a voluntary tax could work, NOT. A progressive income tax is the only fair way to fund the government.
 
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