Ttystikk's vertical goodness

[killemsoftly]

You the man Ty! If i were in tip-top shape i"d do four "verts" from floor to ceiling. Each would be 1600w on 4' centers. Let's see: C=2Pir. =6.28x2=~12.5. H=7'. OK, so that's 87.5 x 4=`350ft^2. Ty you low-balling sob !!! That would be effin' awesome! You have vision holmes!

I see what you mean about heat n humidity bro. To run 6400w in that space (800ft^3) or more would require: dehuey, 24k cooling, etc, etc.......If i ran one supersilo instead i"d have 2x1kw of lights to cool and i'd get ........roughly 200ft^2 of canopy. That's impressive. And i"d have much less of a cooling/dehuey issue.

I've never done a big vert like this. Hell, I've never done a small vert. I'm working with new seed and i think that i want to see this plant do it"s thing in a vert sog (7" of height and 1600w). Plus, i also get the veg time while the sog is blooming to create 4-6 monsters for that space. If i see this as a progression then i can definitely see doing a silo or 2 walls o dank for mid-june. I have the ability to vent outdoors and i can mount a 12k btu a.c unit in the window as well. I'm thinking cool tubes with a twist. on the intake side i could run a heater core(s)/handler to drop the incoming tube air from, potentially, as high as 90F down to 75f. In your experience, is that feasible? Regardless of supersilo or wall o dank, do you think 6 will do or is 12 a safer and more realistic way to go? I'm working with a plant that has strong haze tendencies. I imagine it will go 2-3 times in height when it is bloomed. I think it's critical to see this plant perform in sog before i go big.

Gracias amigo, any/all feedback would be great.



p.s. you have no idea how glad i am to have found where u r chillin! there are very few guys pushing the envelope out here on the forums. As far as i"m concerned we are taking the ideas Heath started pumping out in '07 to their logical conclusion. Not that they are "his". Ideas r just out there. No one invented calculus. Not newton and not leibniz. it exists wether we like it or not. I think you and i and some other like minded growers have a great opportunity to take verting to a whole nother level. PreVerts Rule!!

<30# by November or bust!>

 

[tystikk]

You the man Ty! If i were in tip-top shape i"d do four "verts" from floor to ceiling. Each would be 1600w on 4' centers. Let's see: C=2Pir. =6.28x2=~12.5. H=7'. OK, so that's 87.5 x 4=`350ft^2. Ty you low-balling sob !!! That would be effin' awesome! You have vision holmes!

I see what you mean about heat n humidity bro. To run 6400w in that space (800ft^3) or more would require: dehuey, 24k cooling, etc, etc.......If i ran one supersilo instead i"d have 2x1kw of lights to cool and i'd get ........roughly 200ft^2 of canopy. That's impressive. And i"d have much less of a cooling/dehuey issue.

I've never done a big vert like this. Hell, I've never done a small vert. I'm working with new seed and i think that i want to see this plant do it"s thing in a vert sog (7" of height and 1600w). Plus, i also get the veg time while the sog is blooming to create 4-6 monsters for that space. If i see this as a progression then i can definitely see doing a silo or 2 walls o dank for mid-june. I have the ability to vent outdoors and i can mount a 12k btu a.c unit in the window as well. I'm thinking cool tubes with a twist. on the intake side i could run a heater core(s)/handler to drop the incoming tube air from, potentially, as high as 90F down to 75f. In your experience, is that feasible? Regardless of supersilo or wall o dank, do you think 6 will do or is 12 a safer and more realistic way to go? I'm working with a plant that has strong haze tendencies. I imagine it will go 2-3 times in height when it is bloomed. I think it's critical to see this plant perform in sog before i go big.

Gracias amigo, any/all feedback would be great.



p.s. you have no idea how glad i am to have found where u r chillin! there are very few guys pushing the envelope out here on the forums. As far as i"m concerned we are taking the ideas Heath started pumping out in '07 to their logical conclusion. Not that they are "his". Ideas r just out there. No one invented calculus. Not newton and not leibniz. it exists wether we like it or not. I think you and i and some other like minded growers have a great opportunity to take verting to a whole nother level. PreVerts Rule!!

<30# by November or bust!>

LOL The only thing that won't fit into your scenario is anyone to work the plants once they're all crammed in there!

My tubs are 15" tall and my trellis is 6.25' x 4' = 25 ft², so I figured three of those per silo times four silos = 300 ft². And it would still be impossibly tight!

 

[tystikk]

The way I run my Super Silo is with four of my 25 ft² trellis, totalling 100 ft². It's a smidgen over 5' in diameter, with two thouies lighting it. The light to square footage remains the same, it's just twice as many lights covering twice as many trellis panels, lol.

The advantage is this; in a smaller silo, the thouie tends to burn in the middle and attenuate too much at top and bottom. With the Super Silo, the sites are six inches further away, reducing light intensity by a full third. It might not seem like enough of a change to make such a big difference but thanks to the magic of the inverse square law, light falling directly adjacent to bare bulbs on the trellis no longer burn- unless they were shaded in veg until they were suddenly exposed to it, another issue entirely.

In addition, the pattern of light attenuation from each bulb complements the other so that the entire height of the silo gets more evenly lit, with no dark spots. Soooo... no place too dark, no place too bright!

It gets better, too- since the trellis is now taller than it is wide, the plants fill it MUCH better; only once have I gotten a plant to fully fill in a four foot tall by six foot wide trellis. Most leave a foot on each side empty, which is of course unacceptable. Three of the first four plants I've ever put in a Super Silo have filled their trellis, a tough trend to ignore.

 

[killemsoftly]

jDefinitely. the dimensions lend to 2 options: wall o dank left/wall of dank right or SuperSilo(SS). Cause I"m lazy: WOD L/R

 

[tystikk]

Imma gonna keep posting until I answer all your questions, lol It might take awhile!

First, I went vertical in large part to eliminate that layer of glass between bulb and plant. I'm so happy with my choice that I suggest using cool tubes as a very last option, only if forced. Every layer of material reduces the light available, and it heats up- exactly what you're trying to avoid! Instead, let the plants do it naturally- and get ready to wring that air out like a sponge all day, lol

I'm not afraid to admit that I am currently venting the room when RH climbs too high. It's costing a lot of CO² tank money, but the alternatives are worse.

 

[tystikk]

jDefinitely. the dimensions lend to 2 options: wall o dank left/wall of dank right or SuperSilo(SS). Cause I"m lazy: WOD L/R

Here's my issue with this; the heart of the silo concept is the strict maintenance of the bulb to trellis distance, which forces the cylindrical shape based on the inverse square law. Squaring it off will reduce efficiency. I'll admit I don't know by how much.

My goal is to build a modular unit that can be multiplied and manipulated to fit nearly any space, even if not perfectly. It is designed to maintain the essential indoor dimensions while being as flexible as possible in each installation.

 

[tystikk]

I'm still going in and training them every day, spending maybe 10 minutes or less daily, pushing growing tips through the trellis to the bright side.

As the three week mark approaches, I really want to take a lot of the larfy stuff off the outside to let the plant concentrate its energy on the shoots inside where the light is.

I do have a few gaps here and there, but I have at least 75% coverage. Not bad for a first run!

 

[taint]

What do you tell your clients regards the mold and seeds in your buds ty?

 

[tystikk]

What do you tell your clients regards the mold and seeds in your buds ty?

Funny, I've never had that conversation with them. What do you tell them?

 

[killemsoftly]

Hey Ty, I hear ya about the shaping of the plant around the bulb. Seems we are stuck with the geometry eh? Gee, I'm so hard done by!LOL by the by, who's the a$$hole. Gotta love riu, trolls abound....

You know I gotta agree, going to the wall of dank is sheer laziness and doesn"t take advantage of the natural geometry of the light coming off the bulb. Yes, i also agree about the cooltubes. Right now i"m running an open MH bulb (the larger size) off my hps ballast (i just de-wire the ignitor) to veg. I usually work with a hat ( keep bumping my head off the bulb. I keep the air in 800ft^3 moving via 3 fans (plastering trick). I can barely feel any heat at 6". Awesomeness.

i confess. I'm lazy and trying to avoid the drive out to the county to buy 6x6 cattle fence. there it is. i have confessed. I want to go to a fencing that uses 4" or 6" squares as i believe it will be a lot easier to work with than 2 or 3" mesh. I'm interested: have you found that to be the case?

You"re definitely on the mark about runnning one silo in my space. i think any dimension of 12'x12' or less lends itself to the supersilo. To go to the pipedream of 4 smaller silo's would be too much work with too little space. i had thought: just do 4 trees and use 2 thouie's on top of each other but i just don't think you get the inverse square law working in your favour as you mentioned. i don't want to end up in a situation where, due to convenience/laziness my trees grow into the bulb and end up 6" away and then i'm fighting light burn. Seems much easier to get the fencing, hang it from ceiling mounted eye-hooks and tie everything off during veg and stretch. Then i have a canopy i can control and i'm able to move air around much easier. i can def see having 20 gal containers on casters too and rigging up 2x4's so that everything (plant, container, trellis) is movable. Have you foiund this to be the case?

I',m just glad that in a month i can use an 'airbox' that i will make to cool off my room and intake/exhaust directly outdoors (am currently running carbon filter: have chimera's schazz2 and they have a skunk block that built that strain; definitely not for the faint of heart!).

Problem is i ran into a high ratio of males with that strain and re-ordered seeds to cover myself hence the need to do a vertSOG in the meantime.

 

[killemsoftly]

Just to be fair to chimera: i got 100% germination. killed one out of 5. Did have 30 c/88 f temps for a week. have one that i believe will show pistils after 2 weeks flower. The plant has a beautiful structure and has coped well with my learning curve. likes ec in mid-range. stinks good in veg. def need carbon filter. i have heard murmurings of a tendency for more males but i cannot confirm that. my random sample of 10 cannot be considered indicative. one would have to take a random 30 seeds and grow out under ideal conditions to see a proper distribution curve re:male/female ratios. i have not done that. Do not take what i have said in an off-hand way to be fact. Chimers"s seeds are available at: www.hempdepot.ca

They're service is tip-top. they email confirm shipping if you provide email. i have sent cash and his guys are honest: a rare trait in the seed biz. i will continue to order from them due to service, honesty, etc. Also, i will continue to hunt in chimera's stuff as i believe he puts out some very special stuff. Recently he added over 6 new strains, including 'CBD Lullaby', which i absolutely must have for myself and a bru.No, I don't get anything for saying this. it is my honest opinion and i'm an honest guy. i made some mistakes and, as i mentioned, my results are probably anomalous. Further, i plan on working with my males (smoke the leaf to check potentcy, put em outdoor to check for vigour, mold/mildew resistance, etc). Yes, I am just another pollen-chucker but practice makes perfect.

 

[killemsoftly]

The way I run my Super Silo is with four of my 25 ft² trellis, totalling 100 ft². It's a smidgen over 5' in diameter, with two thouies lighting it. The light to square footage remains the same, it's just twice as many lights covering twice as many trellis panels, lol.

The advantage is this; in a smaller silo, the thouie tends to burn in the middle and attenuate too much at top and bottom. With the Super Silo, the sites are six inches further away, reducing light intensity by a full third. It might not seem like enough of a change to make such a big difference but thanks to the magic of the inverse square law, light falling directly adjacent to bare bulbs on the trellis no longer burn- unless they were shaded in veg until they were suddenly exposed to it, another issue entirely.

In addition, the pattern of light attenuation from each bulb complements the other so that the entire height of the silo gets more evenly lit, with no dark spots. Soooo... no place too dark, no place too bright!

It gets better, too- since the trellis is now taller than it is wide, the plants fill it MUCH better; only once have I gotten a plant to fully fill in a four foot tall by six foot wide trellis. Most leave a foot on each side empty, which is of course unacceptable. Three of the first four plants I've ever put in a Super Silo have filled their trellis, a tough trend to ignore.

Curious, are you stacking your 1kw lights?

I was thinking of doing that: 1kw on top and a 600 under. Might run the 600 mh for additional spectrum. I thought that i could go for 7' of height by doing this. That would provide for 200sq/ft of trellis. (C=2pir=2*3.14*5=30) Then when i add the vertical dimension of 7' i would get 200 sq/ft of trellis. That would be awesome. I think i would want 8 beasties (2 tiers of 4), with each beast covering 3.5x3'. the second tier would be tough with rdwc unless you went to a big stand alone for each one. Ty, do you think 20 gal is sufficient or is that not enough of a buffer for ph swings? If not, and due to initial outlay, i will probably just use 6gal pots with flock and 2 high flow dripper per pot. I will have to run gutters regardless if i recirc or dtw but hey, no pain no gain.

cheers buddy!

 

[tystikk]

Killenem, you are living up to your nickname, in the most unintentional of ways; I'm on a glorified cellphone so being able to respond to do many detailed questions all at once is hard with this interface. Give me some time to work through what you've written here, lol

 

[tystikk]

Curious, are you stacking your 1kw lights?

I was thinking of doing that: 1kw on top and a 600 under. Might run the 600 mh for additional spectrum. I thought that i could go for 7' of height by doing this. That would provide for 200sq/ft of trellis. (C=2pir=2*3.14*5=30) Then when i add the vertical dimension of 7' i would get 200 sq/ft of trellis. That would be awesome. I think i would want 8 beasties (2 tiers of 4), with each beast covering 3.5x3'. the second tier would be tough with rdwc unless you went to a big stand alone for each one. Ty, do you think 20 gal is sufficient or is that not enough of a buffer for ph swings? If not, and due to initial outlay, i will probably just use 6gal pots with flock and 2 high flow dripper per pot. I will have to run gutters regardless if i recirc or dtw but hey, no pain no gain.

cheers buddy!

Yes, I stack my thouies, because I see no reason to give the lower half of the plants short shrift. I've never seen an MH make more or better quality product. I've never seen or used a CDM type bulb, so I can't speak to them.

If you want to use radius for calculating your circumference, you double it. If you use diameter for area, halve, THEN square it; you've gotten your numbers off by exactly double; 16' in circumference divided by pi is a shade over 5' in diameter. 16x6.25=100 ft² of trellis surface area, somehow you ended up at double this result.

I am attracted to this size- and early results in testing are supportive- because it places the trellis 30" away from the bulb. This reduces leaf burn. Having two bulbs all but eliminates dark spots. Both of these together means I don't need a light mover to avoid hot spots.

As a design choice, I placed all my RDWC sirs on the ground and encouraged my plants to grow and be TREES! Man, when you DON'T top a pot plant in stretch it shouts up and out like crazy! It seems a waste not to take advantage of that. Do a vertical SOG to bridge the gap between first opportunity and when the staged veg system you built concurrently (?) has bloom ready plants, your cylinder should be ready.

I used to be adamant about the idea that a bloom room is for blooming and nothing else. I've softened my stance on this; while I still feel that most of veg needs to happen elsewhere, the last veg stage before flip needs to be on the trellis, in order for the plant to get big enough to cover its whole trellis panel by the time stretch has finished.

 

[tystikk]

Just to be fair to chimera: i got 100% germination. killed one out of 5. Did have 30 c/88 f temps for a week. have one that i believe will show pistils after 2 weeks flower. The plant has a beautiful structure and has coped well with my learning curve. likes ec in mid-range. stinks good in veg. def need carbon filter. i have heard murmurings of a tendency for more males but i cannot confirm that. my random sample of 10 cannot be considered indicative. one would have to take a random 30 seeds and grow out under ideal conditions to see a proper distribution curve re:male/female ratios. i have not done that. Do not take what i have said in an off-hand way to be fact. Chimers"s seeds are available at: www.hempdepot.ca

They're service is tip-top. they email confirm shipping if you provide email. i have sent cash and his guys are honest: a rare trait in the seed biz. i will continue to order from them due to service, honesty, etc. Also, i will continue to hunt in chimera's stuff as i believe he puts out some very special stuff. Recently he added over 6 new strains, including 'CBD Lullaby', which i absolutely must have for myself and a bru.No, I don't get anything for saying this. it is my honest opinion and i'm an honest guy. i made some mistakes and, as i mentioned, my results are probably anomalous. Further, i plan on working with my males (smoke the leaf to check potentcy, put em outdoor to check for vigour, mold/mildew resistance, etc). Yes, I am just another pollen-chucker but practice makes perfect.

Thanks for the good words about Chimera Seeds. While it's important to know who the scammers are in an industry, it's equally or even more important to give props where they're due.

 

[tystikk]

Hey Ty, I hear ya about the shaping of the plant around the bulb. Seems we are stuck with the geometry eh? Gee, I'm so hard done by!LOL by the by, who's the a$$hole. Gotta love riu, trolls abound....

You know I gotta agree, going to the wall of dank is sheer laziness and doesn"t take advantage of the natural geometry of the light coming off the bulb. Yes, i also agree about the cooltubes. Right now i"m running an open MH bulb (the larger size) off my hps ballast (i just de-wire the ignitor) to veg. I usually work with a hat ( keep bumping my head off the bulb. I keep the air in 800ft^3 moving via 3 fans (plastering trick). I can barely feel any heat at 6". Awesomeness.

i confess. I'm lazy and trying to avoid the drive out to the county to buy 6x6 cattle fence. there it is. i have confessed. I want to go to a fencing that uses 4" or 6" squares as i believe it will be a lot easier to work with than 2 or 3" mesh. I'm interested: have you found that to be the case?

You"re definitely on the mark about runnning one silo in my space. i think any dimension of 12'x12' or less lends itself to the supersilo. To go to the pipedream of 4 smaller silo's would be too much work with too little space. i had thought: just do 4 trees and use 2 thouie's on top of each other but i just don't think you get the inverse square law working in your favour as you mentioned. i don't want to end up in a situation where, due to convenience/laziness my trees grow into the bulb and end up 6" away and then i'm fighting light burn. Seems much easier to get the fencing, hang it from ceiling mounted eye-hooks and tie everything off during veg and stretch. Then i have a canopy i can control and i'm able to move air around much easier. i can def see having 20 gal containers on casters too and rigging up 2x4's so that everything (plant, container, trellis) is movable. Have you foiund this to be the case?

I',m just glad that in a month i can use an 'airbox' that i will make to cool off my room and intake/exhaust directly outdoors (am currently running carbon filter: have chimera's schazz2 and they have a skunk block that built that strain; definitely not for the faint of heart!).

Problem is i ran into a high ratio of males with that strain and re-ordered seeds to cover myself hence the need to do a vertSOG in the meantime.

Round trellis for the WIN! I found it easier to work with and the shape helps hold bendy fencing square and in shape better.

No idea who that guy was. That was his first post in the vert section, one can only hope they get better from here.

I'm not going to knock Cap's wall o' dank, because that may well be the right approach for certain space and bulb combinations. Yes, the pure shape is a cylinder, but plants are adaptable...

I'm stepping away from the use of MH anywhere in my op, veg included, in favor of HPS. Every time I've replaced either MH or T5/CFL, my results have improved- especially when controlling for wattage. The last one to go is over my final prebloom veg stage, a stage I'm eliminating in favor of putting the ladies in their blooming trellis a week or three before flip. No one can tell me that one MH above is worth two thouies in (between) the bush!

Dude, that's not just air movement, that's a fuckin' HURRICANE! I love it! Add a howling wind soundtrack and toss a lil dry coco up in the air and I'd call that a high quality simulated experience! LMFAO!

My next shot at trellis fencing will be 4" square mesh, big enough to get hands through but small enough for good support and stability.

I like one Super Silo in that room, for all the reasons you mention, plus the fact that you need to be on your climate control game with this setup; once those girls start cranking out growth, the amount of water they'll be transpiring will be awe inspiring- and you'll need to make sure they get enough to drink without pH and EC swings, AND be ready to remove a lot of water from the airspace. Experience as a drywaller will be handy here, as while I'm on record as saying higher humidity is good for growth, I'm also going to tell you that too much of anything is never good. If your RH climbs over 75%, do whatever it takes to bring it to about 70%. As late bloom and finish approach, drop RH gradually, and for the final week it needs to be in the fifties. The extra RH is for supporting the plant's growth and use of augmented CO² levels. Once it's done growing, both high CO² levels and the high humidity it works best with are no longer desirable or welcome.

I did not follow what you were talking about with two thouies above each other.

The reason I'm talking about RH so much will become self evident right about early peak bloom, if your girls are filling in their trellis. Once it happens, you're in scramble mode, so I'm telling you now to be ready. My water chilling system is up to the job of cooling my spaces but it can't keep up with the dehuey requirements. Until I figure out a more permanent solution, I'm just venting the room when RH exceeds 75%. It wastes a lot of CO² tank money, but it's worth it.

Another option to filling your room- once you have a few vert runs under your belt and know more about their various requirements; consider 600W bulbs double stacked in a trellis three feet in diameter (10' circumference) by six feet tall, for sixty ft² per trellis. Four of these could be crammed into a bedroom of the size you mentioned...

If you hook your trellis to the ceiling, how would you move it around on casters? I have thought about building a system on wheels, but the only place it makes any sense at all is in a commercial setting. All my trellis are too tall to fit through my doors as it is. I harvest in place instead of taking the plant somewhere else. Once all the nugs are off the tree they're a lot easier to work with anyway, and I see no reason to disassemble or move the entire works for any stage. I put my plants in netpot bucket lids, so THEY would be mobile and the sites they go into wouldn't need to be.

 

[taint]

I guess l got confused when you made these posts.

 

[tystikk]

Yup. No client got anyone near that. It's MY job to induce error by pushing the limits.

 

[killemsoftly]

Hey ty, sorry buddy didn"t mean ta 'kill ya' hahaha!

I'm just doing my math a little weird. C=2Pir gives me a circumference. when i multiply out my circumference by the height of the silo i am able to compare a vert super silo area to a conventional horizontal method area. So, i misunderstood your basic parameter----> bulb distance, ie 'centers'. So with 'centers' of 5', bulb distance is around 2.5' at begining of bloom and 1.5' at end? ok, so c=16' if i manage to fill up to say 6' then i have 96 ft^2 of trellis wheres a 'hori' gives only 32ft^2. It is triple the growing area.

Yeah i know.....i'm an animal, right?....go big or go home i say

I'm sourcing an 18.5k btu window a/c unit. the limiter is my window width (27"). if 29" i coulda gone 22k. oh well. I also can source dehuey's for as low as $50 used. I'm one of these guys who can fix/re-engineer anything (nearly). I built my own 240v 50 amp powerboard. So, i will do a little research re: how manby btu/amps i need to run to dry out 75% humidity air at 84F. I am planning on doing what ur doing: venting out, dehuey, a/c, but no co2. I can run 2x 1kw bulbs with 600w under them. However, i will flip-flop the 600w a la HR as i don"t want to overheat the room and go high on my board's capacity. I guess i need to run a few more numbers to feel content with my line vs. load and know i am in a good spot. 12 amps of lights, 15 amps cooling is 27 amps at 240v. So i have lotsa room for dehuey, fans, etc. Another 23 amps at 240v seems plenty of room. I will try to source a dehuey that is 240v. Be nice to find a good one that runs at 7 amps and does 2400 ft^2. Then i am at 34 amps peak. plenty of room.

The plastering trick is to put 4 fans. 1 in each corner of the room. then u point them at the ceiling (45 degree angle) put em on high. Do not oscillate. they all throw air at the same spot in the ceiling. It creates a 'cyclone effect' that draws air up (good for verters). the air swirls around the room. i currently have 3-5" seedlings that are shy 2 weeks old in this room under a 1000mh. they love it. My clones (8-12") love it, my 3 trees (3'by 3', 5x3 and 4x4) all love it. I can cut 200 off the trees right now if i want. Everybody is happy and there are no dead spots in the room. Plasterers use the cyclone to dry ceiling corners out in basements during the hot, humid summers of the construction season. It's a good technique. the advantage to trellising re: air movement is that it creates much less resistance than a 5x5 trees does so the cyclone should work pretty well in my room. also, i plan on making a plenum out of 24ga sheet metal. this way the 18.5k a/c unit pulls hot air from the ceiling area and blows cold air at 4'. a lot of that will fall down and be drawn through the canopy by the 4 fans creating the cyclone. Should run real nice.

Really appreciate your experience and input. It really does help to work it out here. I finished a drawing yesterday and will throw it up some time this week.

Also, Ty don"t feel pressured to get back to me fast. I'm actually a patient guy just a bit excited currently. I read and re-read your posts to get a sharper understanding of what your saying and what realities i will be facing. Hence the research on a/c, dehuey, etc. If you see me post don't worry if you can't reply for a week. No biggee dude. At a certain point i gotta figure it out myself and implement for my time line. that's always my responsibility and things are shaping up pretty good.


Just know, it has been invaluable to have picked your brain. Even if you never gave me another juicy nugget I'm pretty content with what i now know. Have plans to put down a real sticky primer and do eggshell white in there. I want the ability to clean the surface of the room. I will heed your advice re: vegging in place (last 10-14 days) and not moving once in the "bloom room". Very sound.

Cheer and thanks again amigo!

 

[tystikk]

I guess l got confused when you made these posts.

Let me help clear up your confusion. If you think I let my clients act as my guinea pigs when testing new designs, equipment, techniques or environmental conditions, then you're completely, utterly mistaken.

I take it upon myself to take the risks, try the new ideas, push the environmental conditions to their limits, see what happens when shortcuts are taken, etc.

If one never tests the limits, how does one ever find them? Regarding RH, for example. It's a lot like salting your steak; none isn't very tasty, a little is better, the right amount (for your taste) is best- and too much is too much. Does it make sense not to use the salt just because it's possible to use too much? Of course not! The same is true of RH... and since I've run low, medium, high and extreme values, I know what those values really are, how they differ from the court of politically correct forum opinion, and what factors influence when and how a given value might be correct or not and what to look for. One does not gain this knowledge by coloring safely inside the lines.

For reference; not one of my clients has gone vertical yet. On the other hand, not one uses water bottled nutes from a hydro store anymore, either.