Lockdowns don't work.

[hillbill]

People over fucking money, always

Where are all the Prolife assholes?

 

[dandyrandy]

Praying.

 

[abandonconflict]

People over fucking money, always

Where are all the Prolife assholes?

Nice bumper sticker. Problem is, people need an economy too.

 

[hillbill]

Next stop for areas not “stay at home”, factories and especially meat packing plants which will really fuck things up. Eventually that will do much more harm to people and profit.

We must get it under reasonable control and have very widespread testing

 

[hanimmal]

New York is a ghost town. New Orleans is a ghost town. Seattle is a ghost town. Those 3 cities all were locked down in early March. Since, numbers have skyrocketed.

Lockdowns have been implemented in many states and municipalities, ostensibly to "flatten the curve". In the 3 outbreak epicenters mentioned earlier, the curve was near vertical subsequent to lockdowns being implemented.

South Korea never implemented such a lockdown. You can go to a bar, wake up the next morning and go to class and then walk your classmate home and give her a rim-job in South Korea. No lockdown. Somehow, flattened curve. Same goes for Taiwan. Same goes for and get this, because it's remarkable, Hong Kong. 3 examples of flattened curves with no lockdowns. 3 examples of lockdowns with the opposite of flattened curves.

It's time to question the lockdowns, because they don't flatten curves, but they do flatten the economy.

So how many of their population did they test? What did they do with those that they tested that were positive? And I am all for tracking, but it really is just not happening at all here.

 

[f series]

Next stop for areas not “stay at home”, factories and especially meat packing plants which will really fuck things up. Eventually that will do much more harm to people and profit.

We must get it under reasonable control and have very widespread testing

If people stay home and everything is shutdown, what's the point of test

 

[rkymtnman]

i agree with the lockdowns mostly not working but given the situation in the US, what else would have been viable? just letting it pass over the nation like trump almost allowed would have been much worse.

south korea was able to test, than isolate and then trace all their contacts to lockdown them as well. which seems to me to be the best idea and tactics. and their people dont' have the mentality of us: guns, freedom, "murica.

but like zedd said, the horse was outta the barn here b/c of trump's slow response to the hoax.

 

[zeddd]

You have no argument because you have no data, bye for now.

I’m wondering if your position is from your own personal fear of catching the disease, you told us you were 65 and bragged about your financial security. I’m alright Jack, fuck all the others, I can chill reading my 1980,s scientific Americans and shovel out shitty advice to the stoned youth cos I’m a “street philosopher”. Am I close?

 

[rkymtnman]

If people stay home and everything is shutdown, what's the point of test

that's the point, nothing is shut down. all of the fast food places in my little town are all open. the people that work there arent' beign tested so they could be infecting everybody they come in contact with

 

[abandonconflict]

So how many of their population did they test? What did they do with those that they tested that were positive? And I am all for tracking, but it really is just not happening at all here.

Look, those are great ideas, obviously testing and tracing from the start would have been the right strategy. Instead, we listened to Trump, and then blamed Trump for his malfeasance. We can still do those things while it's still 0.15% of the population infected. Lockdowns clearly don't work.

What I'm saying here though, we really need to question this lockdown. It's really going to flatten the wrong curve (economic), cause it's apparently not flattening the curve it was meant to (infections).

 

[hillbill]

People at meat packing plants are “essential”. They are less likely to be exposed to trumpvirus in areas that enforce Stay At Home which helps keep plants open.

Several huge meat packing plants are closed already because of it

 

[hanimmal]

If people stay home and everything is shutdown, what's the point of test

So we can get a accurate picture of what this virus is, how widespread it is. This isn't the first and won't be the last disease, so it is time we start to think about how we need to change the way we do stuff going forward.

 

[rkymtnman]

Look, those are great ideas, obviously testing and tracing from the start would have been the right strategy. Instead, we listened to Trump, and then blamed Trump for his malfeasance. We can still do those things while it's still 0.15% of the population infected. Lockdowns clearly don't work.

What I'm saying here though, we really need to question this lockdown. It's really going to flatten the wrong curve (economic), cause it's apparently not flattening the curve it was meant to (infections).

i think the lockdown along with a mask for everybody would have helped. but we went 2 months where they said dont' wear masks.
and our lockdown wasn't like italy. there bars and restaurants were closed, not open for delivery or pick up in store.

 

[hillbill]

trump has been so right about the hoax so far so we should trust him on opening the country.

Yeah, makes sense I guess.

 

[hillbill]

trump has been so right about the hoax so far so we should trust him on opening the country.

Yeah, makes sense I guess.

Rightie Logic

 

[abandonconflict]

i think the lockdown along with a mask for everybody would have helped. but we went 2 months where they said dont' wear masks.
and our lockdown wasn't like italy. there bars and restaurants were closed, not open for delivery or pick up in store.

I'm talking about Italy too. After the complete lockdown, with enforcing goons and checkpoints and checking of quaraantine passes and mayors shouting at park goers, even with that, numbers skyrocketted. I'm not making it up, you can easily google when it started. Same in NYC, it's been a ghost town since early March. See the graphs on worldmeters.com. The lockdowns did nothing. The people who were most susceptible to infection still made contact with fomites. The lockdowns did not flatten the curve. The average incubation period is 8 days. Look at the last month in New York since it's been a ghost town. If it was going to flatten the curve it would have sooner. No flat curve, just a vertical climb. Even if we're at the apex, it doesn't mean the lockdown helped. It just means that those most susceptible to infection got infected.

 

[rkymtnman]

I'm talking about Italy too. After the complete lockdown, with enforcing goons and checkpoints and checking of quaraantine passes and mayors shouting at park goers, even with that, numbers skyrocketted. I'm not making it up, you can easily google when it started. Same in NYC, it's been a ghost town since early March. See the graphs on worldmeters.com. The lockdowns did nothing. The people who were most susceptible to infection still made contact with fomites. The lockdowns did not flatten the curve. The average incubation period is 8 days. Look at the last month in New York since it's been a ghost town. If it was going to flatten the curve it would have sooner. No flat curve, just a vertical climb. Even if we're at the apex, it doesn't mean the lockdown helped. It just means that those most susceptible to infection got infected.

what was option 2 then given our gov't not taking it seriously for months? do nothing and let it wash over the country?

 

[DIY-HP-LED]

I’m wondering if your position is from your own personal fear of catching the disease, you told us you were 65 and bragged about your financial security. I’m alright Jack, fuck all the others, I can chill reading my 1980,s scientific Americans and shovel out shitty advice to the stoned youth cos I’m a “street philosopher”. Am I close?

We all have our biases zeddd, they are tied to our mortality first and then our social and economic survival. I'm doing what I can to survive the ordeal and following the advice of experts. I'm ok financially, many are not and are getting antsy as the cash runs low, in Canada the government has been doling out cash for now. Used to read SA back in the stone age before the internet, my advice is the wisdom of age and experience in dealing with emotional issues and motives. Our emotions prioritise out thinking, I teach on the street and with our local meditation group, until a month or so ago when I saw this coming and canceled the meetings. If you read my posts you'll know that I also have concerns about how this is gonna pan out in poor countries where people must work everyday to eat and there is no government dole. We will soon see the effects of not social distancing in such places quickly, we won't have long to wait either.

I understand you are still working though and must consider yourself fortunate to do so. Now I got other threads to cover and a bunch of stuff to do in the real world, a world also constrained by regulation.

 

[abandonconflict]

what was option 2 then given our gov't not taking it seriously for months? do nothing and let it wash over the country?

Setting up field hospitals, arranging mass graves and mobilizing the hospital ships probably helped. The massive amount of testing that has already taken place is great, it's still not too late to continue that, only about 0.15% of the US population is infected.

However, if we're choosing between complete lockdowns in outbreak epicenters and not having complete lockdowns in these places, then we need to seriously ask if they actually work, while also looking seriously at what harm they do, which is considerable.

It's like taking cyanide to cure cancer. We still need an economy and if there is no economy, what will happen to the healthcare system then?

When people are starving because supply chains are broken, who will man the checkpoints to see your quarantine pass?

 

[zeddd]

I'm talking about Italy too. After the complete lockdown, with enforcing goons and checkpoints and checking of quaraantine passes and mayors shouting at park goers, even with that, numbers skyrocketted. I'm not making it up, you can easily google when it started. Same in NYC, it's been a ghost town since early March. See the graphs on worldmeters.com. The lockdowns did nothing. The people who were most susceptible to infection still made contact with fomites. The lockdowns did not flatten the curve. The average incubation period is 8 days. Look at the last month in New York since it's been a ghost town. If it was going to flatten the curve it would have sooner. No flat curve, just a vertical climb. Even if we're at the apex, it doesn't mean the lockdown helped. It just means that those most susceptible to infection got infected.

The virus can be aerosolised, every Tuesday Brits up and down the country are clapping for key workers, standing on their front door steps. Most live in terraced housing or apartments. They are separated by a few metres. A sneeze can carry a droplet 27 feet, presumably the wind can carry it further. Maybe lockdown is increasing infection rates?