Should the US shed blood for Ukraine

Should the USA along with NATO defend Ukraine with troops.

  • Yes

    Votes: 40 40.4%

  • No

    Votes: 59 59.6%
  • Total voters
    99
Fogdog

Fogdog

Well-Known Member
djumbir said:
By all definitions, yes. Btw the major US reason for the invasion, weapons of mass destruction (lol) makes it as illegitimate as Russians invasion on Ukraine. Even worse, as they found none, while there are plenty of AZOV scum roaming around in Ukraine. But I don't expect you, indoctrinated Yankees, to get the picture :D

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hey djumbo,

I never supported the Iraqi war and in fact called for war crimes trials due to the torture the US conducted during that war. Gitmo should never have been used to house POWs and it should be closed down immediately.

What does that have to do with what Putin is doing?
 
Roger A. Shrubber

Roger A. Shrubber

Well-Known Member
djumbir said:
By all definitions, yes. Btw the major US reason for the invasion, weapons of mass destruction (lol) makes it as illegitimate as Russians invasion on Ukraine. Even worse, as they found none, while there are plenty of AZOV scum roaming around in Ukraine. But I don't expect you, indoctrinated Yankees, to get the picture :D

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and i don't expect you to realize that the time of dictators is closing, quickly. it's time for a new chapter in the history books, the democratic era, when people finally learned to live without fear of their own governments....
we have a lot of work to do on our own, but we're so far ahead of russia that we can't even see you in our rear view mirrors anymore
 
Roger A. Shrubber

Roger A. Shrubber

Well-Known Member
djumbir said:
I'm talking about equal illegitimacy here, nothing more. I'm not supporting Vlad whatsoever
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yes you are...why bother lying about it? you try to say you're impartial, but you aren't. you support killers, you support putin...if you didn't, you wouldn't put so much forced amusement into your replies...the rictus grin of someone who knows he's losing but can't admit it
 
Roger A. Shrubber

Roger A. Shrubber

Well-Known Member
djumbir said:
Ukraine is a highly divided country and has been a buffer zone quasi independent country since its beginning. Either a Russian puppet state (prior to orange revolution, which was very much supported and helped by west, don't wanna say orchestrated) and like Belarus now, or a liberal "democracy". Putin's puppets have lost in 2 consecutive elections over there, and that's a problem for him. So far, he was able to control more or less the countries in his neighborhood, but Russia's soft power obviously cannot match the US one. It never could. Belarus is also getting shaky (there were protest there last year against Luka), then a revolution in Kyrgyzstan last year and now an attempt in Kazakhstan...
So, Russia can either accept being slowly eaten by "soft power" (which consists of diplomacy, economy and intelligence sector) or start using "hard power" which is the only parameter that puts Russia into super power company. They don't have anything else going for them.
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then, they'll become extinct...they're losers. they can't adapt and survive in the modern world, you can't argue with evolution. thousands...millions of species have become extinct since the world started, because they could not adapt and survive in a changing world. putin and his brother dictators are facing extinction, and all the trouble they cause now are just the thrashing of a dying animal
 
D

djumbir

Well-Known Member
Roger A. Shrubber said:
yes you are...why bother lying about it? you try to say you're impartial, but you aren't. you support killers, you support putin...if you didn't, you wouldn't put so much forced amusement into your replies...the rictus grin of someone who knows he's losing but can't admit it
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No I'm not. I couldn't care lass about the guy. I am though very much willing to continue trolling about it for as long as you guys so passionately advocate complete and quite fascist boycotting of all Russian, especially sports and literature. Where do you all draw the hate from? Rocky films? Rambo? Are you aware of how vile your rhetoric is?
This luckily never happened to US, despite their numerous adventures. And it shouldn't be happening now. Enough with double standards
 
Fogdog

Fogdog

Well-Known Member
djumbir said:
No. By funding it, they organized the whole thing.

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Short version: Some guy posted a long winded opinion piece that contained plenty of claims but zero proof of them about some sort of purported and nefarious scheme to do what? Get popular leaders elected in fair elections?

What proof is there that "they" organized the whole thing. Who are they? That article did nothing to establish validity in your claim. Are you a child?

What point are you trying to make with that post, djumbo? For extra credit, connect that point to the Russian invasion of Ukraine.
 
D

djumbir

Well-Known Member
Fogdog said:
Short version: Some guy posted a long winded opinion piece that contained plenty of claims but zero proof of them about some sort of purported and nefarious scheme to do what? Get popular leaders elected in fair elections?

What proof is there that "they" organized the whole thing. Who are they? That article did nothing to establish validity in your claim. Are you a child?

What point are you trying to make with that post, djumbo? For extra credit, connect that point to the Russian invasion of Ukraine.
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If you really can't relate it to what's happening in Ukraine now, even in theory, then I'm not gonna waste any more words explaining it to you.

Edit: if you are willing to learn, I'll be happy to teach you :)
 
DIY-HP-LED

DIY-HP-LED

Well-Known Member
djumbir said:
If you really can't relate it to what's happening in Ukraine now, even in theory, then I'm not gonna waste any more words explaining it to you.

Edit: if you are willing to learn, I'll be happy to teach you :)
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I see Zelenskiy was in his office today on TV and it could be a sign. That Russian convoy north west of Kyiv is apparently undergoing attack from Ukrainian army and partisan units almost along it's entire length. It has been reported that there is no screen of combat troops guarding it and it is wide open to attack, particularly the fuel and ammunition trucks that are carrying rocket and artillery reloads too and every time one of those blows up in takes out other vehicles in the column, particularly if they are bumper to bumper while stopped on the road. They might not even have drivers, as they might have run for the hills. In those circumstances a few lightly armed partisans with guns and RPGs could do a lot of damage.
 
DIY-HP-LED

DIY-HP-LED

Well-Known Member
djumbir said:
If you really can't relate it to what's happening in Ukraine now, even in theory, then I'm not gonna waste any more words explaining it to you.

Edit: if you are willing to learn, I'll be happy to teach you :)
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If reports on that convoy north west of Kyiv coming down the west side of the Dnieper at Kyiv are true, the combat units at the front will be starved of supplies, ammo and food, rocket and artillery units will become useless. Those pricks killing civilians west of Kyiv might find themselves cut off and in a lot of trouble. The plan is to keep the highways into Kyiv from the west open and keep the arms ammo and food coming in so they can stock up for a fight. It makes sense to concentrate force here and these assholes are gonna regret using their ammo to murder women and children, instead of saving it for those who will be trying to kill them. If they committed war crimes, I would expect summary execution on the spot, unless they are really lucky. If in fact their supplies are cut, this should be made clear to them, it will be clear to other Russians as well.
 
hanimmal

hanimmal

Well-Known Member
djumbir said:
No I'm not. I couldn't care lass about the guy. I am though very much willing to continue trolling about it for as long as you guys so passionately advocate complete and quite fascist boycotting of all Russian, especially sports and literature. Where do you all draw the hate from? Rocky films? Rambo? Are you aware of how vile your rhetoric is?
This luckily never happened to US, despite their numerous adventures. And it shouldn't be happening now. Enough with double standards
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Putin is killing innocent people and you are willing to troll for him. That is the definition of you supporting Putin. But I guess you making whatever dictator you do support happy at the end of the day is good enough for you (unless you are just one of the endless line of paid trolls).
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Fogdog

Fogdog

Well-Known Member
djumbir said:
If you really can't relate it to what's happening in Ukraine now, even in theory, then I'm not gonna waste any more words explaining it to you.

Edit: if you are willing to learn, I'll be happy to teach you :)
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I asked you a question. Lets start with the easiest.

Who are "they"

In any case, I don't expect you to even try. I'll just say that I read the copy that hannimal posted. It contained many claims and zero proof of them. So, I will just disregard it as anti-US propaganda. Thanks for trying.

Moving on to something you actually said.

djumbir said:
No I'm not. I couldn't care lass about the guy. I am though very much willing to continue trolling about it for as long as you guys so passionately advocate complete and quite fascist boycotting of all Russian, especially sports and literature. Where do you all draw the hate from? Rocky films? Rambo? Are you aware of how vile your rhetoric is?
This luckily never happened to US, despite their numerous adventures. And it shouldn't be happening now. Enough with double standards
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Thank you for confirming the sanctions are hurting Russia. You say you don't support Putin's invasion. Instead of sanctions, what do you suggest be done to stop him from ever doing it again?
 
Roger A. Shrubber

Roger A. Shrubber

Well-Known Member
djumbir said:
Where do you all draw the hate from? Rocky films? Rambo? Are you aware of how vile your rhetoric is?
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i draw my anger, my justified anger, from dictators trying to remake the world into a kingdom they can rule, a russky mir...but that world will never be. the world will be free, or it will be dead, there will NEVER be a russky mir.
why do you try to legitimize anything a brutal murderous regime is involved with? there is no room for anything russian while the leader of all russians is having people murdered, by more russians, to fulfill a personal fantasy of world domination. even if they withdraw right now, there can be no peace with russia while putin still breaths...and if that is vile rhetoric..then fuck it, it's still true
 
Roger A. Shrubber

Roger A. Shrubber

Well-Known Member
hanimmal said:
Putin is killing innocent people and you are willing to troll for him. That is the definition of you supporting Putin. But I guess you making whatever dictator you do support happy at the end of the day is good enough for you (unless you are just one of the endless line of paid trolls).
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not questioning your intent, but i am questioning the validity of the photo with the man holding his arm out... all the people in that picture are dressed VERY lightly for the Ukraine winter...it might be from an earlier attack on Crimea?
 
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