Nonbelievers, how did you lose your religion?

Chief Walkin Eagle said:
Awe cute, your pretending you dont have beliefs. You BELIEVE there is no god, Hep, dont lie. Thats how you were raised, you were raised to believe what people tell you, raised to be in a labeled group. You were a kid, accepted the first explanation of life that was given to you, kept that ridiculous explanation for a while until you finally caught on. Dropped, then it was almost like you were a kid again, fresh mind! But sadly, people came and told you whats what, and you accepted it, just repeated the process with no original thought... Im quite fine with keeping the discussion here, thanks =) unless this is the last word.
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Wow, you should apparently be writing Heph's biography. You know an awful lot about his upbringing and life choices. Or was that all speculation because your vagina got a bit of sand in it?
 
rpgdude said:
Again you are wrong. What your basically saying is that critical thinking skills prevent belief in the "supernatural" and that is simply not true. There are many people who would put us both to shame in critical thinking skills who believe in God. Also to say all faith stems from stupidity and ignorance is a stupid, ignorant and naive thing to believe. Many come from need. A need to see your loved ones again, a need to explain your existences, a need to justify war, a need for justice not seen in life and on and on and on. Its just not so simple. And the reason people don't go on believing in Santa is because its an accepted myth and we are told its bull shit. How many religious people do you know who believe in Santa? By your standard all none critical thinkers should believe in god, they don't, no more then all critical thinkers are atheist. You reasoning is flawed by a very narrow view of people. Religion, all religion is born from human nature and human nature is much more complex then your view allows. Any way we are not going to agree on this but we do agree its all bull shit so say your peace or not. Im tired of repeating myself. No hard feelings and all that. Later bro
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Critical thinking, when applied, honestly prevents belief in a god of any sort. Critical thinking requires you to ask yourself "What evidence is there of god?". The obvious answer is "none". He doesn't come down for visits, and left no evidence behind of his existence. Any person who concludes that god exists, isn't using critical thinking skills to establish it. Critical thinking does it's job, cognitive dissonance is what makes it possible for smart people to ignore it. Fear is a strong motivator, fear of death even more so. It can cause a man to forsake reason for comfort.
 
kpmarine said:
Critical thinking, when applied, honestly prevents belief in a god of any sort. Critical thinking requires you to ask yourself "What evidence is there of god?". The obvious answer is "none". He doesn't come down for visits, and left no evidence behind of his existence. Any person who concludes that god exists, isn't using critical thinking skills to establish it. Critical thinking does it's job, cognitive dissonance is what makes it possible for smart people to ignore it. Fear is a strong motivator, fear of death even more so. It can cause a man to forsake reason for comfort.
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Imo a very valid counterargument can be brought in re evidence of God. While your answer "none" is obvious at a coarse, first-pass level, one can ask if there is evidence of a "hidden hand" guiding subtler processes more integrated in nature and life. That principle underlies classic examples of apophenia gone cancerous, like astrology, reflexology, Kabbala. The question "is there less obvious sign of a divine in action? cannot be so neatly discharged imo, and it returns the question to the realm of faith. Unless/until our brains evolve into a different, more internally-transparent mode of mentation, capable of really vetting the subtle ghostly signals for what's real, I do not see a way for either side to claim victory. In the meantime, i imagine our duty is to be very wary of stories that excite our very human capacity for animism ... while being damn sure to never toss out unlikely (but not impossible) babies in that bathwater. ceterum censeo I really dislike this strange limp-along mode that RIU finds itself using today. I can't Like, and I can't use italics without an old html trick. cn And what the ~obscene roar~ is it with not keeping linebreaks!!
 
Heisenberg said:
If an opinion contrary to your own makes you angry, that is a sign that you are subconsciously aware of having no good reason for thinking as you do. If some one maintains that two and two are five, or that Iceland is on the equator, you feel pity rather than anger, unless you know so little of arithmetic or geography that his opinion shakes your own contrary conviction. The most savage controversies are those about matters as to which there is no good evidence either way.
Persecution is used in theology, not in arithmetic, because in arithmetic there is knowledge, but in theology there is only opinion. So whenever you find yourself getting angry about a difference of opinion, be on your guard; you will probably find, on examination, that your belief is going beyond what the evidence warrants.
—Bertrand Russell
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Good stuff, leader of the robots. You can clearly see that Im showing anger and not pity when I say "Poor misguided Hep, cant think for himself, needs to follow a herd"... Oh how angry that sounds, your right, I should really be more comfortable with what I know lol. Here Hep thinks hes a big boy yet he depends on those that are smarter to argue for him.
 
Padawanbater2 said:
Well that's an error on your part, you're presuming to know intimate details about Hep's personal transition to nonbeliever which you have no way of knowing.

All you know about him is he doesn't believe in God.
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Nah I heard him when he first dropped his belief, he was kissing a lot of ass, probably kissed your ass too and asked for your "knowledge".
 
Chief Walkin Eagle said:
Good stuff, leader of the robots. You can clearly see that Im showing anger and not pity when I say "Poor misguided Hep, cant think for himself, needs to follow a herd"... Oh how angry that sounds, your right, I should really be more comfortable with what I know lol. Here Hep thinks hes a big boy yet he depends on those that are smarter to argue for him.
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That's so Raven...
 
rpgdude said:
Again you are wrong. What your basically saying is that critical thinking skills prevent belief in the "supernatural" and that is simply not true. There are many people who would put us both to shame in critical thinking skills who believe in God. Also to say all faith stems from stupidity and ignorance is a stupid, ignorant and naive thing to believe. Many come from need. A need to see your loved ones again, a need to explain your existences, a need to justify war, a need for justice not seen in life and on and on and on. Its just not so simple. And the reason people don't go on believing in Santa is because its an accepted myth and we are told its bull shit. How many religious people do you know who believe in Santa? By your standard all none critical thinkers should believe in god, they don't, no more then all critical thinkers are atheist. You reasoning is flawed by a very narrow view of people. Religion, all religion is born from human nature and human nature is much more complex then your view allows. Any way we are not going to agree on this but we do agree its all bull shit so say your peace or not. Im tired of repeating myself. No hard feelings and all that. Later bro
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No matter how intelligent the bliever is, he wouldn't put me to shame using his CTS (critical thinking skills) to prove his beliefs. The moment he says there is a god, he set aside his CTS on the subject. By simply saying "I don't know if there is or isn't a god", I would have already put more thought into it than he has.

"many come from need. A need to see your loved ones again, a need to explain your existences..."
Believing in a god to solve those ^^ issues is ignorant. You're misinformed on the true answers. You ignore all logic just to be satisfied. I'm not asking why people believe, I'm telling you that they're ignorant for believing in the first place.

I tell you that religion is bull shit, so why don't you drop your beliefs like you dropped your beliefs with santa (assuming you believed in santa)? Also, what does other people's beliefs in religion have to do with you? YOU should have enough logic and reasoning to say "No, all of this is nonsense" regardless of how many people believe.

No, I've met some stupid atheists that lack CTS. I don't have a standard.

No hard feelings at all.. Just voicing our opinions. Notice how we haven't insulted each other? :)
 
cannabineer said:
. The question "is there less obvious sign of a divine in action? cannot be so neatly discharged imo, and it returns the question to the realm of faith. Unless/until our brains evolve into a different, more internally-transparent mode of mentation, capable of really vetting the subtle ghostly signals for what's real, I do not see a way for either side to claim victory.
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The power of the leprechauns gave me luck!!

Even if we can't full out "calim victory", we can admit the beliefs are silly.
 
Hepheastus420 said:
No matter how intelligent the bliever is, he wouldn't put me to shame using his CTS (critical thinking skills) to prove his beliefs. The moment he says there is a god, he set aside his CTS on the subject. By simply saying "I don't know if there is or isn't a god", I would have already put more thought into it than he has.

"many come from need. A need to see your loved ones again, a need to explain your existences..."
Believing in a god to solve those ^^ issues is ignorant. You're misinformed on the true answers. You ignore all logic just to be satisfied. I'm not asking why people believe, I'm telling you that they're ignorant for believing in the first place.

I tell you that religion is bull shit, so why don't you drop your beliefs like you dropped your beliefs with santa (assuming you believed in santa)? Also, what does other people's beliefs in religion have to do with you? YOU should have enough logic and reasoning to say "No, all of this is nonsense" regardless of how many people believe.

No, I've met some stupid atheists that lack CTS. I don't have a standard.

No hard feelings at all.. Just voicing our opinions. Notice how we haven't insulted each other? :)
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Theres the Hep I like to laugh at lol You believe that god doesnt exist Hep, dont lie, you are not agnostic, and you didnt develop critical thinking skills, you asked what you should believe after your dropped your religion and everyone spoon fed you "knowledge" and you ate it all up, not once putting original thought into your decisions. Feel free to PM me your broken record of an argument.
 
I never had one. Well I guess a self one.

I never truthfully believed in santa clause either.

That being said cuz it probably sounds pretty mean.. lol, if religion is your thing, whatever.. I just don't buy it. Ill glady become educated on the subject though shits interesting none the less..
 
Chief Walkin Eagle said:
Theres the Hep I like to laugh at lol You believe that god doesnt exist Hep, dont lie, you are not agnostic, and you didnt develop critical thinking skills, you asked what you should believe after your dropped your religion and everyone spoon fed you "knowledge" and you ate it all up, not once putting original thought into your decisions. Feel free to PM me your broken record of an argument.
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You seem quite desperate to shove your strawman down Hep's throat. It appears the actual words coming from his mouth are too hard to counter, so you insist on arguing with this pretend Hep. Even more interesting is that you set this strawman up so that you can beg the question.
 
Hepheastus420 said:
What are these religions that don't have silly beliefs?
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I wasn't talking about religions. Anything so formalized can be safely discarded imo. I was trying (failing, perhaps) to differentiate between religion and possible awareness of the divine. cn (edit) Heisenberg seems to have refined meaning from my low-grade ore.
 
cannabineer said:
I wasn't talking about religions. Anything so formalized can be safely discarded imo. I was trying (failing, perhaps) to differentiate between religion and possible awareness of the divine. cn (edit) Heisenberg seems to have refined meaning from my low-grade ore.
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Ahhhh I get what you're saying now. My bad. And I agree.
 
Heisenberg said:
You seem quite desperate to shove your strawman down Hep's throat. It appears the actual words coming from his mouth are too hard to counter, so you insist on arguing with this pretend Hep. Even more interesting is that you set this strawman up so that you can beg the question.
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Im not trying to counter his words, Im pointing out how he contradicts himself. He says hes agnostic but I seen him say "god does not exist" on more than one occasion. He BELIEVES that god does not exist, as if that belief is more respectable than those who have a belief in god. Im pointing out that he is still the same blind follower, this time with a different viewpoint. He had a fresh mind when he dropped his christian beliefs, but then the process repeated itself and people started telling him how the world really works and he accepted that explanation without doing any searching what so ever, I call that being intellectually lazy and being dependent on others. Now he thinks he has CTS (he keeps mentioning that like its a boy scout badge lol) and has everything figure out, its comical to watch his long responses.
 
Chief Walkin Eagle said:
Im not trying to counter his words, Im pointing out how he contradicts himself. He says hes agnostic but I seen him say "god does not exist" on more than one occasion. He BELIEVES that god does not exist, as if that belief is more respectable than those who have a belief in god. Im pointing out that he is still the same blind follower, this time with a different viewpoint. He had a fresh mind when he dropped his christian beliefs, but then the process repeated itself and people started telling him how the world really works and he accepted that explanation without doing any searching what so ever, I call that being intellectually lazy and being dependent on others. Now he thinks he has CTS (he keeps mentioning that like its a boy scout badge lol) and has everything figure out, its comical to watch his long responses.
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....Said the nutjob
 
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