First Grow - 2 x 1000w

lordjin

lordjin

Well-Known Member
Powerhouse setup. The lights, the wiring, the room, the air movement. Wow.

Only thing is, there is a balance to the circle of activity in a grow room. I ramble on about it in my journal, but I'm not sure how many are taking that philolosphy to heart.

You have immense power in your lights. This is pure energy the plants must convert into green growth (photosynthesis). If they're getting to much energy from the light, and not enough nutrient to feed on, an imbalance in the circle will occur, and they will not be able to convert the energy and all that light will just end up hurting them.

It kills me to see such awesome gear and the plants not responding to it the way they should. That's why I dropped soil long, long ago. Your leaves will yellow, the nutes will lock out, and when you take photos and ask for advice, you get an ocean of possible problems and possible treatments... None of which you're 100% sure is the problem in your situation. And bugs and fungus love, love, love soil! It is dirt, after all.

I'm not here to just criticize you, as a number of your plants are doing great, but consider this for a moment. I can't help but feel in a situation like yours, you have taken great care and expense in creating an awesome race car, but you put regular street tires on it. Please consider an active hyroponics system. It will not increase the overall cost of your investment significantly. Put a decent hydro system in that exact room, and you'll have 35%-40% bigger, stronger plants. And if you have a problem, you can show me and I can tell you exactly what's happening.

Edit:
and unlike soil, in hydro, if a problem occurs, it will show itself quickly, and any remedy applied will take effect just as quickly. Your plants could be almost twice the size they are now in almost half the time if they were in bubble buckets, aero bins, or drip/return.
 
lordjin

lordjin

Well-Known Member
Dubbz0r said:
After talking with a friend we came to the conclusion that I'm not feeding them enough nutrients. Each time they were fed nutes it was 1/4 strength or less (twice in almost 4 weeks). They have deficiencies because they're not being fed properly. I was advised to feed them 1/2 to 3/4 strength for their next feed. They've been getting too much water with very little in the nute department. I had the "less is more" statement stuck in my head and was afraid to feed them. Tonight the soil will most likely be a little moist so the feed will have to wait until tomorrow night. I may try a foliar feed tonight but nothing will go in the soil until tomorrow or later.

Update on my house situation... I have 30 days from tomorrow to move out. That's not going to be enough time to finish any harvest, but the plants may have a temporary home if and when I need it. *fingers crossed*
Click to expand...
And also consider that the intensity of the light without enough nute compounded the problem. Hey, it's better than the dreaded lock-out I guess.

With hydro, you go by the numeric readouts on metering instruments to tell how much your plants are feeding, making it much more precise than soil. You also know exactly what the ph is at all times, again, unlike soil.

Soil doesn't suck. That's not what I'm saying. I'm saying that it can actually be harder than hydro in certain ways contrary to the popular notion. If you don't have a perfect custom mix of organic soil that you have personally created through years of trial and error, then you're just playing guessing games as a beginner. There is far less guessing with hydro, as it literally is growing by the numbers. In that sense, a much clearer objective for the newbie.

Edit:
I don't mean to hammer on you. I hope you don't take it like that. But you have gone to the trouble of putting that great room together... why not go all the way, friend? How would you like plants that make you worry only because they're growing too fast and big? I think that's what you had in mind when you bought all that stuff and assembled such a room, am I right?
 
ru4r34l

ru4r34l

Well-Known Member
Dubbz0r said:
After talking with a friend we came to the conclusion that I'm not feeding them enough nutrients. Each time they were fed nutes it was 1/4 strength or less (twice in almost 4 weeks). They have deficiencies because they're not being fed properly. I was advised to feed them 1/2 to 3/4 strength for their next feed. They've been getting too much water with very little in the nute department. I had the "less is more" statement stuck in my head and was afraid to feed them. Tonight the soil will most likely be a little moist so the feed will have to wait until tomorrow night. I may try a foliar feed tonight but nothing will go in the soil until tomorrow or later.

Update on my house situation... I have 30 days from tomorrow to move out. That's not going to be enough time to finish any harvest, but the plants may have a temporary home if and when I need it. *fingers crossed*
Click to expand...
I think there are many problems improperly diagnosed as nutrient burn which has led many to ALWAYS error on the side of less is more, with my current lemon skunk grow I am feeding 4 plants using a modified recirculating program and have been as high as 2200 PPM and i am only about 2 weeks in to flower so it will get higher.

I have read lot's on lemon skunk and they seem to be able to take up loads of nutrients. It may be a bad idea to do any foliar feeding if the leaves are malformed; maybe wait until they have shown visible signs of recovery, best of luck.

regards,
 
bekindbud

bekindbud

Well-Known Member
lordjin said:
And also consider that the intensity of the light without enough nute compounded the problem. Hey, it's better than the dreaded lock-out I guess.

With hydro, you go by the numeric readouts on metering instruments to tell how much your plants are feeding, making it much more precise than soil. You also know exactly what the ph is at all times, again, unlike soil.

Soil doesn't suck. That's not what I'm saying. I'm saying that it can actually be harder than hydro in certain ways contrary to the popular notion. If you don't have a perfect custom mix of organic soil that you have personally created through years of trial and error, then you're just playing guessing games as a beginner. There is far less guessing with hydro, as it literally is growing by the numbers. In that sense, a much clearer objective for the newbie.

Edit:
I don't mean to hammer on you. I hope you don't take it like that. But you have gone to the trouble of putting that great room together... why not go all the way, friend? How would you like plants that make you worry only because they're growing too fast and big? I think that's what you had in mind when you bought all that stuff and assembled such a room, am I right?
Click to expand...
I have done side by side test with Soil and Hydro....Yes Hydro does have massive growth and you harvest a lot more but nothing taste better then plants grown in soil plus soil is more forgiving then Hydro. I seem to do less work with Hydro which I like a lot. They both have there pros and cons but I feel its the grower's preference and what they are comfortable with. I do both cause I like to compare each strain so that I can get the best possible bud out there. It will be the forever debate of growing.....Hydro vs Soil. I recommend that every grower should do a run in soil and hydro do see whats best for them.

Peace

BKB
 
Dubbz0r

Dubbz0r

Well-Known Member
Had a HUGE reply all typed out.... hit the back button and it's gone. 40 minutes of typing lost into the interwebbings of cyberspace. Fuck.
 
lordjin

lordjin

Well-Known Member
bekindbud said:
I have done side by side test with Soil and Hydro....Yes Hydro does have massive growth and you harvest a lot more but nothing taste better then plants grown in soil plus soil is more forgiving then Hydro. I seem to do less work with Hydro which I like a lot. They both have there pros and cons but I feel its the grower's preference and what they are comfortable with. I do both cause I like to compare each strain so that I can get the best possible bud out there. It will be the forever debate of growing.....Hydro vs Soil. I recommend that every grower should do a run in soil and hydro do see whats best for them.


Peace

BKB
Click to expand...
Aha! Hydro vs. Soil debate. Love it.

You're right, friend. The hydro def has its drawbacks. So not really much of a debate here. I'm not only gonna agree with you on taste, but I gotta throw smell in there too. Especially with OGK, in hydro, sometimes the smell/tastes characteristics go all over the place due to the accelerated growth of my style of hydro. I've been frustrated by this in the past and that's why I'm seriously thinking about switching to advanced nutes as I'm told they were specifically formulated for canna unlike the GH I use now.

You're preaching to the choir when you talk about quality of good soil vs. hydro. I believe whenever I brought up the topic, I was always clear to give due props to the soil masters. And I'll do it again now here. I've said it before whenever I've opened my pie hole on the topic: Nothing, and I mean nothing, beats a master organic soil grow done by some old dude with a beard who makes his own mixes and such. I'm not about to start messing with soil at this point in my game because I'm clueless about it, but I'm thinking about a nute brand change for my next. Something more expensive and better for weed.

edit: but oh my gosh if it doesn't grow faster, faster, faster, bigger, bigger, bigger in hydro. That's the trade-off I guess. And compared to the difference in high and taste compared to the difference between say six ounces and ten ounces? And also hydro creating growth vigor that soil can't match? (I've seen many side by sides by expert growers doing a soil pot and a hydro bucket of the exact same strain under the same light. It really is no comparison, the soil plant seems to trail by weeks in growth and never really catches up or thickens up like the hydro). It is a trade off to be sure, but for all those reasons, you can count me among the strictly water heads any day of the week. Peace!

Edit again:
oh, but I've done some laughable soil attempts early on too. So there is that. Quite embarrassing. Lol. So I guess instead of 'graduating' from soil to hydro, I found that soil was too intuitive for me and therefore more difficult, so I moved to, to me, the easier, more exact method of hydro. My intuition isn't very strong, so I opt for digital readouts. Lol. I think there's a true grower's intuition that is commonly known as 'green thumb.' That is more associated with soil imo. I don't consider myself as having a green thumb, but rather a light blue digital tri-meter.
 
Dubbz0r

Dubbz0r

Well-Known Member
Lanternslight said:
I here that, Central heating and A/C FTW! Wishing I had my apartment still. I could fit probably two 4x4x6 tents in my closet :U. It was a sweet 1 bdrm. Have you scoped out where you would put your babies?
Click to expand...
It might be a few weeks until I know where I'm going for sure. When looking for a house, the only thing I'll be searching for is a place for my babies lol Trust me... if the house cannot accommodate my plants, it won't work for me. I found a few, but one that I really like. When I go check a few of them out I'll know more.

lordjin said:
Powerhouse setup. The lights, the wiring, the room, the air movement. Wow.

Only thing is, there is a balance to the circle of activity in a grow room. I ramble on about it in my journal, but I'm not sure how many are taking that philolosphy to heart.

You have immense power in your lights. This is pure energy the plants must convert into green growth (photosynthesis). If they're getting to much energy from the light, and not enough nutrient to feed on, an imbalance in the circle will occur, and they will not be able to convert the energy and all that light will just end up hurting them.

It kills me to see such awesome gear and the plants not responding to it the way they should. That's why I dropped soil long, long ago. Your leaves will yellow, the nutes will lock out, and when you take photos and ask for advice, you get an ocean of possible problems and possible treatments... None of which you're 100% sure is the problem in your situation. And bugs and fungus love, love, love soil! It is dirt, after all.

I'm not here to just criticize you, as a number of your plants are doing great, but consider this for a moment. I can't help but feel in a situation like yours, you have taken great care and expense in creating an awesome race car, but you put regular street tires on it. Please consider an active hyroponics system. It will not increase the overall cost of your investment significantly. Put a decent hydro system in that exact room, and you'll have 35%-40% bigger, stronger plants. And if you have a problem, you can show me and I can tell you exactly what's happening.

Edit:
and unlike soil, in hydro, if a problem occurs, it will show itself quickly, and any remedy applied will take effect just as quickly. Your plants could be almost twice the size they are now in almost half the time if they were in bubble buckets, aero bins, or drip/return.
Click to expand...
First off thanks for stopping by. It's always good to get experience tips, opinions or thoughts from other people. It's appreciated and always welcomed here. :)

Originally I asked about hydro and my grower friends recommended I start out with soil. If not for anything other than getting experience with growing and understanding plants in general. My experience with plants is non-existent so I needed to start out slow. Soil is a little confusing but I'm learning so that is expected on my part. I think with hydro I would have been completely lost. That's not to say it's out of the question but I would like to get a few grows under my belt before moving on to hydro. It is something to consider when I get in my new place and things start going well.

I agree with you on the light/energy comment. These ladies are starving and I'm not feeding them properly. A friend of mine owns a few hydro supply stores in my area and this is the conclusion we came to. My next feed will be with 1/2 to 3/4 strength nutrients. Just looking at the Humboldt feed schedule I know I've been under feeding, especially now that they are in week 2 of flower. They are dying for more nutes (literally lol). My pH is between 6.6 and 6.9 and hasn't fluctuated much since day one. This next feed will tell me a lot about the future of my plants. I'm staying optimistic!

ru4r34l said:
I think there are many problems improperly diagnosed as nutrient burn which has led many to ALWAYS error on the side of less is more, with my current lemon skunk grow I am feeding 4 plants using a modified recirculating program and have been as high as 2200 PPM and i am only about 2 weeks in to flower so it will get higher.

I have read lot's on lemon skunk and they seem to be able to take up loads of nutrients. It may be a bad idea to do any foliar feeding if the leaves are malformed; maybe wait until they have shown visible signs of recovery, best of luck.

regards,
Click to expand...
That's good to hear. Most likely my plants are pissed from being under fed. I've done a little reading on foliar feeding, and most people seem to think it's a fast way to an easy fix?? This topic: The Lost Art of Foliar Feeding has some good tips about foliar feeding. I may hold off for now though or until I see some positive progress from my lemon skunks.

lordjin said:
Lol.

Smoke a bowl, dude. It'll come back to you.
Click to expand...
Exactly what I did! and I didn't touch the fucking mouse this time! haha
 
lordjin

lordjin

Well-Known Member
Oh, you got hydro shop guy. You're golden.

edit:
Then, damn. Wait. You got hydro shop guy's ear to bend and you didn't go for it? I coulda walked you through it through this here website, but if you got a hydro shop owner friend, then by all means try to start a water grow in your new area. And hey, you have enough light power / space to do a side by side hydro / soil yourself if you want to. You could show us all yourself what I mean by the difference.

Peace, bro.
 
Dubbz0r

Dubbz0r

Well-Known Member
Dubbz0r said:
The master kush are pretty dry right now, but the others aren't. I was going to wait until tomorrow and do them all at once.
Click to expand...
After a second, third and fourth look I ended up feeding them just now:

In each 5gal bucket of water:
3 tsp Micro
3 tsp Grow
4 tsp Bloom
1/2 tsp Equilibrium
2 tsp molasses
1 tsp Sea Green

This is the most nutes they've ever had. Hopefully all goes well...
 
Dubbz0r

Dubbz0r

Well-Known Member
lordjin said:
Oh, you got hydro shop guy. You're golden.

edit:
Then, damn. Wait. You got hydro shop guy's ear to bend and you didn't go for it? I coulda walked you through it through this here website, but if you got a hydro shop owner friend, then by all means try to start a water grow in your new area. And hey, you have enough light power / space to do a side by side hydro / soil yourself if you want to. You could show us all yourself what I mean by the difference.

Peace, bro.
Click to expand...
Him and his employees all agreed that soil would be best for me given my circumstances. Not to mention I didn't know you existed until today! haha

I have two people waiting for my move and my harvest to sign me up as their caregiver. Right now it would be pointless to sign them up. So when I do move, the plan will be to set up a 3 room system; clone room, veg room and flower room. With 3 patients I will be allowed 36 plants at one time. I'd like to eventually have 5 patients (5 is max) and a harvest every couple of weeks but that's down the road a ways. First I need to see how this grow turns out. If it's a bust, I may sell off the equipment and get a day job. If it turns out good, then I'll start to put the plan into place. We'll see what happens!
 
Dubbz0r

Dubbz0r

Well-Known Member
Indeed, but I need to know if I can do this right first lol When midnight comes tonight I will be nervous as hell. That's when the lights come on. That's also when I'll most likely see if I helped or hurt my ladies.

Off to court I go! Yay!



NOT.
 
Dubbz0r

Dubbz0r

Well-Known Member
Lanternslight said:
I am not familiar with the product you are using. Is grow supposed to be used when flowering?
Click to expand...
According to Humboldts feed chart all three nutrients are used up through the 5th week of flower. After the 5th week the only one I stop using is the Grow (these are my base nutrients) and the attached pic shows the feed schedule.


3-Part-Basic.jpg


Edit: My last feeding was not exactly as the chart suggested, but I'm still afraid to over nute! If they look like they enjoyed their feeding last night then I'll bump it up a little more next week. By week 4 I should be using full strength.
 
bekindbud

bekindbud

Well-Known Member
lordjin said:
Aha! Hydro vs. Soil debate. Love it.

You're right, friend. The hydro def has its drawbacks. So not really much of a debate here. I'm not only gonna agree with you on taste, but I gotta throw smell in there too. Especially with OGK, in hydro, sometimes the smell/tastes characteristics go all over the place due to the accelerated growth of my style of hydro. I've been frustrated by this in the past and that's why I'm seriously thinking about switching to advanced nutes as I'm told they were specifically formulated for canna unlike the GH I use now.

You're preaching to the choir when you talk about quality of good soil vs. hydro. I believe whenever I brought up the topic, I was always clear to give due props to the soil masters. And I'll do it again now here. I've said it before whenever I've opened my pie hole on the topic: Nothing, and I mean nothing, beats a master organic soil grow done by some old dude with a beard who makes his own mixes and such. I'm not about to start messing with soil at this point in my game because I'm clueless about it, but I'm thinking about a nute brand change for my next. Something more expensive and better for weed.

edit: but oh my gosh if it doesn't grow faster, faster, faster, bigger, bigger, bigger in hydro. That's the trade-off I guess. And compared to the difference in high and taste compared to the difference between say six ounces and ten ounces? And also hydro creating growth vigor that soil can't match? (I've seen many side by sides by expert growers doing a soil pot and a hydro bucket of the exact same strain under the same light. It really is no comparison, the soil plant seems to trail by weeks in growth and never really catches up or thickens up like the hydro). It is a trade off to be sure, but for all those reasons, you can count me among the strictly water heads any day of the week. Peace!

Edit again:
oh, but I've done some laughable soil attempts early on too. So there is that. Quite embarrassing. Lol. So I guess instead of 'graduating' from soil to hydro, I found that soil was too intuitive for me and therefore more difficult, so I moved to, to me, the easier, more exact method of hydro. My intuition isn't very strong, so I opt for digital readouts. Lol. I think there's a true grower's intuition that is commonly known as 'green thumb.' That is more associated with soil imo. I don't consider myself as having a green thumb, but rather a light blue digital tri-meter.
Click to expand...
Nice post bro, have you ever tried Coco? I heard its almost like the best of both worlds...not really sure, I am trying a CoCo now but having a lot of problems getting dialed in using coco. I think my problem is that I treat the coco like a soil grow and I am probably wrong. When the winter gets here, I am going strictly Hydro and Summer months Soil. I have 3 DWC going right now and the heat is killing me. I am still a nOOb at Hydro and learned summer months and hydro dont mix cause of the damn temps. Do you run hydro during the summer?

Peace

BKB
 
bekindbud

bekindbud

Well-Known Member
Dubbz0r said:
Indeed, but I need to know if I can do this right first lol When midnight comes tonight I will be nervous as hell. That's when the lights come on. That's also when I'll most likely see if I helped or hurt my ladies.

Off to court I go! Yay!



NOT.
Click to expand...
Good luck bro!!!!
 
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