Govita Pro dual ended super HPS?

Rrog said:

IMHO, it'll all be LED. The tech is advancing way too fast and that's where every lighting company is investing. When you're illuminating buildings and parking lots with it, canopy penetration isn't an issue.

I can't get behind a lighting product when most of its output is heat, not light. Inherently that's a problem.

Click to expand...

Even with LEDs, most the output is heat. The very best of them are only in the 40-50% efficiency range. Granted, much better than HID, but still less than half. Some of the cheap ones are no more efficient than HID. Every year, LEDs get better, tho. Not so much with HID. I wonder how many early adopters are wanting to replace their old LEDs with newer models. I plan to go LED after two more grows or so. Unless electricity rates go up substantially. That might accelerate my purchase. Right now, I figure I would only save $35 or so a month, not enough to pull the trigger.

Rrog said:

IMHO, it'll all be LED. The tech is advancing way too fast and that's where every lighting company is investing. When you're illuminating buildings and parking lots with it, canopy penetration isn't an issue.

I can't get behind a lighting product when most of its output is heat, not light. Inherently that's a problem.

Click to expand...

I think the "value" of LED technology is subjective and being "sold" to us. Their projected numbers and real world performance have never met the advertised performance marks and have left way too many holding the bag of this overpriced/under-performing tech.

Personally I see a lot of potential benefit going really old school. The use of kinetic energy like electricity into light via bulbs only releases the heat with the energy, not the CO2 released at the generator. A room full of 1k equivalent whale oil lamps on the other hand may have a CO2 level/'value" to literally double your garden yields as these LED manufactures have promised for a decade now

Are they making LED light houses?

I see that all major lighting manufacturers are propelling the technology statistically faster than computer tech is advancing. No similar efforts in incandescent. No one except a stoner company like UFO is selling LED it to anyone. The big players that drive the industry are focused on LED.

A person may not want to use LED now, but someday someone will call that bulb user an old fart. IMHO.

Rrog said:

I see that all major lighting manufacturers are propelling the technology statistically faster than computer tech is advancing. No similar efforts in incandescent. No one except a stoner company like UFO is selling LED it to anyone. The big players that drive the industry are focused on LED.

A person may not want to use LED now, but someday someone will call that bulb user an old fart. IMHO.

Click to expand...

That's a business cycle that produces mass amounts of "obsolete models" to pay for research and development. I'm not sure you're getting the bang for your buck as the computer industry R&D/marketing you refer to. One of the biggest reasons LEDs are sold is for it's long "lifetime" value I don't know many growers living on the "cutting" end of technology these days

The pace of LED tech vs computer tech is not my metric. I got that quote from the Wall Street journal

Bottom line- LED the future and it's already here. The tech is better, brighter and cheaper than when I built a unit 8 months ago. The all-white LEDs are primarily what guys are using.

People keep talking about LEDs being efficient but I have never seen an LED grow compare in terms of G/W of a well dialed and well setup HPS. They might be efficient in light to heat output, but are they efficiently putting out spectrum and is the fact the light is focused and directional not also hurting their efficiency?

It's been tough witnessing the obscene profitability of these corporations pimping this LED tech for the past decade now, not only by ripping off consumers but the hidden government subsidies exploited to boot. I hope that excuses me for being such an asshole on the subject

I just see absolutely nothing admirable about selling ideology (green) "value" under the guise of real world performance "value", it simply lacks integrity. Not only have the customers sucked into these tech schemes paid heavily, but every citizen is forced to pay on the backside via tax and subsidy schemes contrived and paid for on K street. You know the same game that the largest (US) corporations in the world (GE) use to pay absolutely no taxes here while using our infrastructure like no other ...

Oh for shits sake. Please don't make a political statement about a light bulb. It's not a Chinese plot.

Wow

i feel you Theman! maybe not a political statement, more like a fact, rrog. i wont put a guy down for his convictions, especially if i have the same ones.

Lol. I'll keep an eye out for new developments in incandescent. And gas street lamps.

Rrog said:

Oh for shits sake. Please don't make a political statement about a light bulb. It's not a Chinese plot.

Wow

Click to expand...

Not my intention, just an honest cost/profit analysis as it relates to the effective and true "value" of this and similar green technologies IMO. I've never seen anyone recoup their personal costs, no less societies (ie tax breaks, subsidies, ect), from Solar, Wind or LEDs. Every LED buyer I know feels ripped off in the end, well ahead of the expected/advertised lifespan and then wonders why ...

There are some big ass piles of cash accumulating from these games and those whom cannot afford it need to be protected (educated) from it. It's a rich man/ivory tower perspective that could use disclaimers similar to mutual funds aimed at the general public. You're a bright guy, you can do the math right? Is it these profiteers exploitation of simplistic political propaganda that make my statement seem "political" to you? As I am as critical of the rich/connected (left) as of the "green movement" (right) where would that land this statement on your political continuum

Rrog said:

Lol. I'll keep an eye out for new developments in incandescent. And gas street lamps.

Click to expand...

Actually this thread is about developing/improving incandescent technology, standard to dual ended HPS to be exact. If the gas street lamp idea takes off, fuck the poor and injustice I'll be getting mine

Hahahahahaha!!!!!!!!!

I gotta say, I have chuckled all day over this one. Typical TM13 wit.

Rrog said:

In 5 years it will all be LED

Click to expand...

lol, wrongo!!

In 5 years it will all be LED in 5 years just as it was 5 years ago.

This is analog vs digital television.

Bluray vs DVD.

Kodak film? Whoda thunk that would take such a dirt nap? The first digital cameras sucked and similarly demonized.

Swiss watches with gears? What's a watch, even?

If you were going to invest your own cash is a lighting company stock, would you really invest with a company that felt incandescent was the future? Or would you invest with Cree?

How did this thread take a turn towards junk LEDs? Question I have is when will double ended 6500k veg bulbs become available?

In Feb 2000 you'd have paid 93.93 per share for your Cree investment and today at historical market highs it's worth 48.83. That is an awful steep lose for investors (nearly -50% in 14 years) and very similar to the decade of LED consumers/growers loses we've chatted about here. Granted this economic game is no less complex than the unjust lawfare we face as medicinal marijuana patients, both lack integrity as they pick winners and losers from K Street. We the People are never the winners nor masters of these propaganda games, but these piles of cash (the costs to society) accumulated are hard to miss and easily reverse engineered in hindsight ...

hammer21 said:

How did this thread take a turn towards junk LEDs? Question I have is when will double ended 6500k veg bulbs become available?

Click to expand...

DE bulbs are not color rated (kelvin), but rather by their PAR (photosynthetically active radiation) output which are currently rated between 1950-2100 micromol/s.

http://www.ushio.com/products/entertainment/mh-umi.php
They are making them now just not for our application yet.