Ideas on how to achieve 90%+ voter turnout rate

Padawanbater2

Padawanbater2

Well-Known Member
Observe & Report said:
It's similar to the difference in risk of credit card fraud from today versus back in the day when they took a physical imprint of your card and everything was done with paper slips that were mailed into the bank. Sure, a waiter or someone at the processor could steal some cards. Now a couple of punks on the other side of the world can install some software into a major retailers or processors network and steal millions of cards before anyone wises up.

Voting is tricky because a proper system only lets registered voters vote a single time while ensuring their vote is counted without anyone knowing what that vote was. Some of the most brilliant people around have spent the last 30+ years designing systems to do so using mathematics to maintain those properties but the systems are mostly impractical.

Given how poorly made the machines to just collect votes in the current physical system are, the chance of a nightmare scenario where elections are undetectably rigged is very high.

Then again, it hardly seems to matter who gets elected.
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So you believe the current system is less corruptible than online voting could be? Is that your main criticism?
 
Padawanbater2

Padawanbater2

Well-Known Member
abandonconflict said:
So you are fond of liberals buying votes with lotteries and rewards but you don't want nonliberals to vote at all. Got it.
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I don't want anyone buying votes. How is implementing a national lottery to get people to vote however they choose "buying votes"? If you said "vote democrat or else you're not eligible for the national lottery!", then I'd agree, that's buying votes. But how is saying "Come out and vote! You could win a million dollars!" endorsing one party over the other? The fact that more voters generally tend to vote liberal has nothing to do with the program at all, that's simply the natural fact of life according to the polls. My desire to implement such a program would obviously be because I want more people to vote liberal because I self identify as liberal. How is that any different from the political playing field of today? You're liberal, you want more people to vote liberal, holy shit, SHOCKING! You're conservative, you probably want more people to vote conservative, my God, what a revelation!..

You're not really breaking new ground with that one, Copernicus..
 
sheskunk

sheskunk

Well-Known Member
Padawanbater2 said:
More votes = more liberal votes, fact
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Padawanbater2 said:
I don't want anyone buying votes. How is implementing a national lottery to get people to vote however they choose "buying votes"? If you said "vote democrat or else you're not eligible for the national lottery!", then I'd agree, that's buying votes. But how is saying "Come out and vote! You could win a million dollars!" endorsing one party over the other? The fact that more voters generally tend to vote liberal has nothing to do with the program at all, that's simply the natural fact of life according to the polls. My desire to implement such a program would obviously be because I want more people to vote liberal because I self identify as liberal. How is that any different from the political playing field of today? You're liberal, you want more people to vote liberal, holy shit, SHOCKING! You're conservative, you probably want more people to vote conservative, my God, what a revelation!..

You're not really breaking new ground with that one, Copernicus..
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abandonconflict

abandonconflict

Well-Known Member
Padawanbater2 said:
I don't want anyone buying votes. How is implementing a national lottery to get people to vote however they choose "buying votes"? If you said "vote democrat or else you're not eligible for the national lottery!", then I'd agree, that's buying votes. But how is saying "Come out and vote! You could win a million dollars!" endorsing one party over the other? The fact that more voters generally tend to vote liberal has nothing to do with the program at all, that's simply the natural fact of life according to the polls. My desire to implement such a program would obviously be because I want more people to vote liberal because I self identify as liberal. How is that any different from the political playing field of today? You're liberal, you want more people to vote liberal, holy shit, SHOCKING! You're conservative, you probably want more people to vote conservative, my God, what a revelation!..

You're not really breaking new ground with that one, Copernicus..
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The only way to get liberal voters to show up is through incentive.

By the way, cool avatar bro.
 
Observe & Report

Observe & Report

Well-Known Member
Padawanbater2 said:
So you believe the current system is less corruptible than online voting could be? Is that your main criticism?
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Online voting could be much more secure than the old nonelectronic system but is unlikely to be so.

You said "if you can pay your taxes online, you should be able to vote online as well" and you're right but the stakes and risks are far, far higher. If half assed online election systems are adopted, and all of the available evidence indicates that such systems will be half assed, then you will certainly see elections being stolen and the rise of dictators, fascism, totalitarianism, genocide, etc... as a result. I mean, worse than today. With no way to demonstrate one way or the other what the true result was.

It should and will happen eventually but it's not as simple as paying your taxes online. Not even close.
 
Padawanbater2

Padawanbater2

Well-Known Member
abandonconflict said:
The only way to get liberal voters to show up is through incentive.

By the way, cool avatar bro.
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I'd disagree with that, I think if you had a presidency or two that was as conservative as the Bush administration, liberals would likely get out and vote (a la Obama..)

But even if that was the only way, what's your point?

Thanks, I'm glad you enjoy it
 
abandonconflict

abandonconflict

Well-Known Member
Padawanbater2 said:
How is wanting more people to vote "buying votes"?

Anyone care to explain that one?
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You want more voters to turn out. You don't care about the opinions of your candidate's detractors. You hope I don't vote based on my personal feelings and relationships. What you're conveying here is that you want to provide incentives to vote in hopes that your candidate will win.
 
Padawanbater2

Padawanbater2

Well-Known Member
abandonconflict said:
You want more voters to turn out.
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Yes
abandonconflict said:
You don't care about the opinions of your candidate's detractors.
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How could I have a candidate in a hypothetical discussion? I don't have a candidate, so how could I care or not about his/her detractors opinions?
abandonconflict said:
You hope I don't vote based on my personal feelings and relationships.
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Yes, as I would have the same hope for every American
abandonconflict said:
What you're conveying here is that you want to provide incentives to vote in hopes that your candidate will win.
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Welcome to the political process. That is exactly the point of having primaries and general elections
 
abandonconflict

abandonconflict

Well-Known Member
Padawanbater2 said:
Yes
How could I have a candidate in a hypothetical discussion? I don't have a candidate, so how could I care or not about his/her detractors opinions?

Yes, as I would have the same hope for every American

Welcome to the political process. That is exactly the point of having primaries and general elections
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Which is why I have no faith in the political process, which is why I don't vote. This is also the reason why liberals are too lazy to vote. That is of course unless there is some incentive like a lottery. There is no perception that anything will change. At least for conservative voters there exists a perception of regression, which motivates them.

Don't try to act like you don't favor a candidate either.
 
TheHermit

TheHermit

Well-Known Member
If people are too lazy to look out for their own self interest, then they get what they deserve. Shouldn't have to give out prizes.

I think making election day a national holiday would have the opposite effect of what you are going for. For the most part, only people with shitty jobs work on national holidays.
 
heckler73

heckler73

Well-Known Member
TheHermit said:
If people are too lazy to look out for their own self interest, then they get what they deserve. Shouldn't have to give out prizes.

I think making election day a national holiday would have the opposite effect of what you are going for. For the most part, only people with shitty jobs work on national holidays.
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What is a "shitty job" as per the definition here?
 
TheHermit

TheHermit

Well-Known Member
Most white collar workers get holidays off. Most service industry workers usually work on holidays. If you walk into a gas station on Christmas there is some poor sap stuck working that day.
 
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