Led Users Unite!

PurpFan

PurpFan

Well-Known Member
Serva said:
Haters?! That‘s the most beautiful bonzai I ever saw! What a BUD! :weed:

Have you ever grown crystal trees with chemicals as child? It looks like the same magic happened with your plant:
Click to expand...
Man that was cool :0)

I never seen one of those before.... Kinda reminds me of a chia pet. Is it strange that I want one as a grown man? Lol
 
PurpFan

PurpFan

Well-Known Member
Off topic, does anyone have any extensive knowledge on breeding?

I was wondering, if I had some F1 seeds where both parents were a purple variety (50/50 indica-sativa) and I bred a couple would all of the offspring be purple as I imagined they would? What would the genetic diversity be??? Any help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks fellas/gals.
 
Randomblame

Randomblame

Well-Known Member
PurpFan said:
Off topic, does anyone have any extensive knowledge on breeding?

I was wondering, if I had some F1 seeds where both parents were a purple variety (50/50 indica-sativa) and I bred a couple would all of the offspring be purple as I imagined they would? What would the genetic diversity be??? Any help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks fellas/gals.
Click to expand...
That depends on stability of the parents. If you cross two stable varieties, such as Skunk1, Northern Lights or something like that, you will probably get a homogenous F1 generation with only one or two phenotypes. However, if the parents are hybrids or even F1, then several phenotypes will occur. Therefore, stable varieties like landraces are often used for breeding because the result has much less variance. The more stable a variety is, the better it is suitable for breeding.
If you cross two stable purple strains, eg. purple Afghan x purple Kush, the offspring will most likely also be purple indika with a weak heterosis effect. If you cross purple Afghan x purple Haze, it could turn into a strong F1 hybrid, where the heterosis effect is more pronounced. The effect is the stronger the higher the genetic differences between both parents is.
But no matter how stable your parents are, you will definitely find a good mother. From this point of view, more variance is quite good.
Only if you want consistent results, where all F1 plants looks the same, then you should be careful to use only stabilized varieties. Paradise Seeds sells two of their stabilized Inbreed Lines, WhiteWidow and another one I forgot. But there are others from other breeders too. Euforia of DutchPassion is eg. a stable Skunk 2 selection which is ideal for own experiments!
 
PurpFan

PurpFan

Well-Known Member
Randomblame said:
That depends on stability of the parents. If you cross two stable varieties, such as Skunk1, Northern Lights or something like that, you will probably get a homogenous F1 generation with only one or two phenotypes. However, if the parents are hybrids or even F1, then several phenotypes will occur. Therefore, stable varieties like landraces are often used for breeding because the result has much less variance. The more stable a variety is, the better it is suitable for breeding.
If you cross two stable purple strains, eg. purple Afghan x purple Kush, the offspring will most likely also be purple indika with a weak heterosis effect. If you cross purple Afghan x purple Haze, it could turn into a strong F1 hybrid, where the heterosis effect is more pronounced. The effect is the stronger the higher the genetic differences between both parents is.
But no matter how stable your parents are, you will definitely find a good mother. From this point of view, more variance is quite good.
Only if you want consistent results, where all F1 plants looks the same, then you should be careful to use only stabilized varieties. Paradise Seeds sells two of their stabilized Inbreed Lines, WhiteWidow and another one I forgot. But there are others from other breeders too. Euforia of DutchPassion is eg. a stable Skunk 2 selection which is ideal for own experiments!
Click to expand...
Thanks a bunch man I appreciate that. I have seeds that are a stable F1 cross of Purple Malawi x PCK (Pakistan Chitral Kush). With both parents being purple the result is a lovely purple plant that is 50% indica and 50% sativa.

Now I'm wondering if I grew a couple of these stable F1 plants and bred them together what kind of results would I likely get in my F2 generation? I'm wondering what kind of genetic diversity would I most likely get? Will 75% of the offspring be indica dominant or vice versa?
 
Randomblame

Randomblame

Well-Known Member
PurpFan said:
Thanks a bunch man I appreciate that. I have seeds that are a stable F1 cross of Purple Malawi x PCK (Pakistan Chitral Kush). With both parents being purple the result is a lovely purple plant that is 50% indica and 50% sativa.

Now I'm wondering if I grew a couple of these stable F1 plants and bred them together what kind of results would I likely get in my F2 generation? I'm wondering what kind of genetic diversity would I most likely get? Will 75% of the offspring be indica dominant or vice versa?
Click to expand...
Yummy! Sounds like a nice strain!
In the F2 you'll get more variance because recessive genes come to light. About 25-75% of the plants are similar to the F1 generation, the rest looks like one of their parents (or even like their ancestors, because you used a stabilized hybrid).
If you want to stabilize the variety yourself, this is done by backcrossing. That is, when you keep a F1 plant with the desired characteristics and cross it with a male from the F2. Repeat that with a male from the F3, then the F4 and so on. If all plants of one generation looks more or less the same, you can consider the variety to be stabilized. A stabillized variety can have more than one phenotyp.
If you have a particularly beautiful female, there is an easier way to fix those very characteristics to the next generation. Feminizising is the keyword!
You will need a Collodial-Silver-Generator (basically some .999 silver wire, a jar, some Aquadest and a 9v driver) and a mother plant whose characteristics you want to fix to the new seed generation. Take some cuttings, switch to 12/12h, treat/spray one or two cuttings daily with collodial silver until these get masculine flowers(50-100ppm strength is recommend). Use the pollen of those "males" to fertilize the remaining cuttings. Although the progeny from this process are not really "stabilized," all plants will be identical because they all carry the same genetics.
This saves you many months of work and today this is the most widely used type of seed production!
Positive side effect: all seeds are feminized.

This is an old thread but it shows very well how you use collodial silver to make fem. seeds.
https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=176233&page=42
 

Attachments

PurpFan

PurpFan

Well-Known Member
Randomblame said:
Yummy! Sounds like a nice strain!
In the F2 you'll get more variance because recessive genes come to light. About 25-75% of the plants are similar to the F1 generation, the rest looks like one of their parents (or even like their ancestors, because you used a stabilized hybrid).
If you want to stabilize the variety yourself, this is done by backcrossing. That is, when you keep a F1 plant with the desired characteristics and cross it with a male from the F2. Repeat that with a male from the F3, then the F4 and so on. If all plants of one generation looks more or less the same, you can consider the variety to be stabilized. A stabillized variety can have more than one phenotyp.
If you have a particularly beautiful female, there is an easier way to fix those very characteristics to the next generation. Feminizising is the keyword!
You will need a Collodial-Silver-Generator (basically some .999 silver wire, a jar, some Aquadest and a 9v driver) and a mother plant whose characteristics you want to fix to the new seed generation. Take some cuttings, switch to 12/12h, treat/spray one or two cuttings daily with collodial silver until these get masculine flowers(50-100ppm strength is recommend). Use the pollen of those "males" to fertilize the remaining cuttings. Although the progeny from this process are not really "stabilized," all plants will be identical because they all carry the same genetics.
This saves you many months of work and today this is the most widely used type of seed production!
Positive side effect: all seeds are feminized.

This is an old thread but it shows very well how you use collodial silver to make fem. seeds.
https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=176233&page=42
Click to expand...
Man you are very knowledgeable in this subject, thanks a bunch. That sure is a lot of backcrossing...

Okay one last inquiry, even though I'll have a bunch of genetic diversity shouldn't they mostly if not all be purple? I know recessive genes come into play but they are both purple strains. I basically want to produce a bunch of seeds that will grow out purple plants regardless of the diversity. What are my chances of producing nothing but purple plants?
 
Randomblame

Randomblame

Well-Known Member
PurpFan said:
Man you are very knowledgeable in this subject, thanks a bunch. That sure is a lot of backcrossing...

Okay one last inquiry, even though I'll have a bunch of genetic diversity shouldn't they mostly if not all be purple? I know recessive genes come into play but they are both purple strains. I basically want to produce a bunch of seeds that will grow out purple plants regardless of the diversity. What are my chances of producing nothing but purple plants?
Click to expand...
With a bit luck the most if not all plants could be purple but it is also possible that a few stay green, at least in the F2.
I would say 80:20 or better!
But do not expect that all F2 plants give good results. Some will be weak and should be sorted out. Recessive genes occur mainly in the F2. Why do not you repeat the original intersection and make a new F1? Would certainly bring better results than an F2! F2 is usually only suitable for selecting a good mother.
Repeat the Malavi x PCK crossing for a new F1, this way you would benefit from the heterosis effect again, which makes the offspring get better like their parents.
 
Last edited:
PurpFan

PurpFan

Well-Known Member
Randomblame said:
With a bit luck the most if not all plants could be purple but it is also possible that a few stay green, at least in the F2.
I would say 80:20 or better!
But do not expect that all F2 plants give good results. Some will be weak and should be sorted out. Recessive genes occur mainly in the F2. Why do not you repeat the original intersection and make a new F1? Would certainly bring better results than an F2! F2 is usually only suitable for selecting a good mother.
Repeat the Malavi x PCK crossing for a new F1, this way you would benefit from the heterosis effect again, which makes the offspring get better like their parents.
Click to expand...
I'm not experienced in this subject matter at all and I'd likely fail at the more complex aspects of breeding. My main goal was to simply create seeds that would 90% guarantee a purple plant. This particular strain has the purple in it's genetics and turns color without the aid of cold weather and such.

Would I be better off just breeding this strain with another purple strain and getting F1 purple plants in that manner? Or would that not be two stable strains? This is very complex, complicated, and confusing lol.
 
Streetsports

Streetsports

Active Member
PurpFan said:
I'm not experienced in this subject matter at all and I'd likely fail at the more complex aspects of breeding. My main goal was to simply create seeds that would 90% guarantee a purple plant. This particular strain has the purple in it's genetics and turns color without the aid of cold weather and such.

Would I be better off just breeding this strain with another purple strain and getting F1 purple plants in that manner? Or would that not be two stable strains? This is very complex, complicated, and confusing lol.
Click to expand...
Here is the breeding forum https://www.rollitup.org/t/chuckers-paradise.865617/
 
Randomblame

Randomblame

Well-Known Member
PurpFan said:
I'm not experienced in this subject matter at all and I'd likely fail at the more complex aspects of breeding. My main goal was to simply create seeds that would 90% guarantee a purple plant. This particular strain has the purple in it's genetics and turns color without the aid of cold weather and such.

Would I be better off just breeding this strain with another purple strain and getting F1 purple plants in that manner? Or would that not be two stable strains? This is very complex, complicated, and confusing lol.
Click to expand...
I would always sprout a few extra seeds with the F2 (25-50% more) and keep only the best ones. In this way you also get the desired plants from the F2 generation. How they actually become at the end you have to try.
 
Steelerdrew79

Steelerdrew79

Active Member
So I used 1000watt HPS lights for a long time and with the cost of energy and how much better technology has progressed with the LED lighting I decided it was time to make the switch I originally purchased one Mars Hydro 600w full spectrum unit but like many other people I didn't understand it's not really 600 watts it's only 250 coming from a walk and the output isn't really even compared to a 600 watt HPS so I'm not really sure where they're getting that but anyways after the slow growth and stretching and getting a little bit comfortable with the lights that close to my plant I went ahead and ordered a second unit same and wow let me tell you I couldn't be more happier with the results and the electric bill here let me just show youYjwju.jpg Oudhj.jpg
 

Attachments

Steelerdrew79

Steelerdrew79

Active Member
Well I like em granted the x is preferred it also was not my light I'm solo on the to mars getting great production so far I'm sure I'm not getting full yield but still quality over quality I keep telling myself
 
Randomblame

Randomblame

Well-Known Member
Have my new light finished tonight for the small 3sft. veg-area.
It consists of
1 HLG-80H-C350B with 6x CXA2540 (3k/V4 bin) in 3s2p circuit and 6 F-strips (3k)in series. COB's run at only 175mA (5.7W, >180lm/W) and the strips at 350mA (7.9W, >200lm/W). 95w at the wall!
In addition, 6 FullSpectrum strips are installed, which hang in 2s3p circuit on an HLG-60H-C350B. 55w at the wall!
The FS-strips I have from 9w T8 grow tubes from e3ay.
In the center I put an 11w Reptisun dessert 10.0 UV-B tube.
Everything is controlled by a Sonoff Dual. One channel controls the 2 LED drivers and the second is for the UVb tube. @Moflow I should tell you when I'm ready. I'm ready!!!6 CXA2540 & 6 F-strips & 6 full-spectrum strips & UVB.png I call it the back-packer.png Max. temps 46,4°C(3h max.), 2 pot's and a switch for the FS-strips.png phosphor layer looks pretty thick an' dark.png actually more white than I thought.png
 
Moflow

Moflow

Well-Known Member
Randomblame said:
And here a few shots of the spectrum changings, without FS-strips...
View attachment 4114147

with FS strips @max. and COB/F-strips dimmed down ...
View attachment 4114148

...and with both drivers fully ramped up. 150w from the wall.

View attachment 4114149

More than enough to grow out a mother from time to time..
Click to expand...

@Randomblame , fan fecken tastic!
That's what I call diy.
I only wish I was as technically minded as you....
With me it's an "A" driver and a screwdriver!

Great build man :clap:
 
Randomblame

Randomblame

Well-Known Member
Moflow said:
@Randomblame , fan fecken tastic!
That's what I call diy.
I only wish I was as technically minded as you....
With me it's an "A" driver and a screwdriver!

Great build man :clap:
Click to expand...
Thanks, buddy! But it's not sooo hard with the right tools. I'm sure you could have done that too! I re-used my old selfmade heatsink and the 6 old COB's, removed the reflectors and 10w 420/660nm COB's and added the F- and FS-strips with a second driver. Re-wiring all the old an' new stuff took me the most effort.
At 20" my cheap lux-meter reads out a center peak of ~80.000lx, with C-factor 69 that's 1160μMol/s/m². Corners/sides are ~68.000-73.000lx.
It's actually much too much for a 3sft. area(50w/sft.) but the HLG-60 can be switched off and both drivers are dimmable anyway, so what!?!
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top