blueberrymilkshake
Well-Known Member
I've been using broken bongs, usually grind it into dust with my Hamilton Beach. But you're a genius. Definitely upgrading to dessicate packs.
The current opinion of silica
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rkymtnman
Well-Known Member
Silicon is found in mineral form as silicon dioxide in rocks such as ignimbrite. ... When silicon dioxide is rendered into a soluble powder and mixed with water, it forms silicic acid. This weak acid is the form of silicon that plants are able to absorb and use in their cells.
this sounds promising for using bulletproof si instead of armor si that i was using.
mudballs
Well-Known Member
Ok stick with me.
Plants can be categorized into three types in terms of their relation to silica: accumulators, intermediaries, and non-accumulators.
Plants differ markedly in their ability to absorb silicon and concentration of Silicon in plants on the basis of dry weight
varies between 0.1 – 10 percent (Liang et al. 2007) [52]
. Silica concentration is found to be higher in monocotyledons (10-
15%) as compared to dicotyledons (0.5% or less)
Our precious plant is a dicotyle for those keeping score.(pdf link1, link 2)
even non-accumulator plants like tomatoes have demonstrated positive responses to silica’s use in fertilization and growth mediums.
Benefits are cool im talking plant size and need of silica.
Let's give our hypothetical juggernaut a favorable 0.5% of mass will be silica. Now let's say there's no size limit, we can veg until the plant is so big, that .5% becomes actually extremely critical...need a math wiz to do it but yeah, oak trees get by with 1% silica content...so we're talking...fkn mother of all cannabis plants before silica becomes a bottle worth buying. Big kudos to dank bongula for recognizing real.
rkymtnman
Well-Known Member
so let's say your dry weight is 300 grams. 1.5 grams of that would be Si by your numbers right?
then how do you figure out how much (mono)silicic acid would give 1.5 grams of Si???
Apostatize
Well-Known Member
There's a nice, neat 3-bulletpoint quote listing the 3 general forms of silica for horticulture (purposes ranging from pesticide to nutrient transporter/greater bandwidth apparently). Pretty sure the labeling on all silica products indicate basic (high pH).
Skipped the general pesticide silica (1st/bottom-tier silica), started with Armor SI (2nd-tier silica). Acquired Power SI (3rd/currently top-tier silica), but am saving it for a later date.
Skipped the general pesticide silica (1st/bottom-tier silica), started with Armor SI (2nd-tier silica). Acquired Power SI (3rd/currently top-tier silica), but am saving it for a later date.
- Power SI is pretty expensive,
- decided to split the 1ml Armor SI/2 gallons (per GH feeding schedule) ~ 1/2 Power SI and 1/2 Armor SI.
- Much more than 1ml/gallon is supposed to turn leaves leathery. That's not normal, I don't want that.
- 2.5 gallons of liquid Armor SI, and 2 kg of dry Power SI. So, that will be interesting.
- Armor SI might be good enough for my purposes (assuming I don't see measurable improvement).
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PJ Diaz
Well-Known Member
This stuff kicks Power Si's ass: https://growgreenmi.com/grow-genius-mono-silicic-acid-40-100ml-3-4-oz-fast-acting-silicon-for-plants-in-all-settings
You only need 1.3ml for 10 gals of solution.
You only need 1.3ml for 10 gals of solution.
ComputerSaysNo
Well-Known Member
It is used on grapes (vineyards) to increase resistance to PM among other things. Wine growers have a lot of problems with fungal attacks. It is foliar fed (sprayed) as far as I understand.
So it is actually used on plants that later get processed into food (well, wine...). I would assume it's safe to use on Cannabis as well, at least during veg.
From what I know it is very effective, as it creates a very thin protective layer on the leaves, that makes them more resistant to pests and fungi. The problem in large scale commercial applications is that it's difficult to apply. Not a problem for home growing Cannabis.
It is also very cheap, way cheaper than the Si supplements one can buy.
Apparently silica is difficult to process in a way that makes it easily available to the plants if used as a supplement, which would explain why those supplements are so expensive.
FWIW Bruce Bugbee highly recommends adding silica, in his lab they use a peat/vermiculite mix, and according to him the vermiculite contains a lot of silica that will be available to the plants.
Wastei
Well-Known Member
I think he's talking out of his ass. Potassium silicate is in readily available form otherwise it wouldn't work in either hydro or foliar application.
PJ Diaz
Well-Known Member
Seems generally Potassium silicate for application via fertigation for cheap effective Plant Available Silicon, although a lot of the silicates found in potassium silicate need to be broken down, consistant low levels of potassium silicate fertigated will supply the plant with enough Plant Available Silicon. As mentioned earlier in this thread dicots do not uptake large amounts of Silicon like monocots such as rice.
For foliar applications, stabilised ortho silic/ mono silic acids seems to be most effective. Something to note is the study linked above is authored by someone working for rexil a stabilised ortho silic acid manufacturer.
I think the questions we truly need answered is how much silicon generally does Cannabis need.
For foliar applications, stabilised ortho silic/ mono silic acids seems to be most effective. Something to note is the study linked above is authored by someone working for rexil a stabilised ortho silic acid manufacturer.
I think the questions we truly need answered is how much silicon generally does Cannabis need.
Kassiopeija
Well-Known Member
silicon dioxide is practically unsolveably in water - it's sand. it's basically everywhere present in soil/earth, but provide only minimal portion of bioavailable si to plants via erosion.
the water glass potassium silicon can be used, or mono/ortho silicic acid where there are also pure biological sources
but cannabis doesnt need all that much of it
Tangerine_
Well-Known Member
Si is widely accepted as a beneficial element for plants. There are dozens of publications available.
It increases soil fertility, yields, increased photosynthesis, decreased abiotic and biotic stress.
But, it requires good mixing procedures or it can fall out of solution easily (form metal silicates like 28.35 posted, lol) I believe this is why so many prefer to use it as a foliar. Unstable pHs lowers solubility.
Most shoot for a target 15-20ppms regardless of source but I go higher with foliars.
Fkin autocorrect
It increases soil fertility, yields, increased photosynthesis, decreased abiotic and biotic stress.
But, it requires good mixing procedures or it can fall out of solution easily (form metal silicates like 28.35 posted, lol) I believe this is why so many prefer to use it as a foliar. Unstable pHs lowers solubility.
Most shoot for a target 15-20ppms regardless of source but I go higher with foliars.
Fkin autocorrect
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mudballs
Well-Known Member
That's @Kassiopeija turf, idk...i dont think she likes me...hope she helps you.
mudballs
Well-Known Member
From my perspective it's mechanical engineering...contractors wanna build a 200ft tower, go to an engineer and he says ok your concrete mix must be this recipe.
Then they say they want a 210ft tower of concrete.
They say you cant do that unless you use this concrete mix ratio that adds .5% silica. Otherwise tower will break under it's own weight. Same with the plant..it can only get so big until it collapses.
All these broken branches arent from lack of silica...ill put it that way.
Kassiopeija
Well-Known Member
from a recent german study about testing the assimilation of various forms of silicic acid & agri products on winegrape leaves as a method to thwart PM:
Silicon concentration [mg Si/g TS] "old leaves" "middle leaves" ab c control c Greemax KSi KSi+Greemax c Aerosil cc Aerosil+Greemax Fig. 4.3: Influence of Greemax, potash water glass (“KSi”) and Aerosilsoil application on the Si concentration in the “old” and “middle” leaves of vine cuttings of the Variety Bacchus after 47 days in the pot experiment (mean values n=5, different letters symbolize significant differences within a leaf fraction [Tukey test, p≤0.05]; error bars indicate the standard deviation from the mean) Greemax® caused compared to the "control" variant Significantly higher Mn concentration in the leaf tissue of the “medium leaf” fraction if it was not applied together with silicates (“KSi”, Aerosil®) (Fig. 4.4).
the KSi had best results, this was done in pot, 5*5 plants repeatedly.
IIRC the potass sil dissociates partially in water to form silicic acid.
the study says it has to be applied via the soil, otherwise (foliar) it will not make it inside the plant but instead form an outside layer which actually is also helpful vs pathogen infestation.
but it has many other positive functions esp. to help the plant shift nutrients around that are usually not very mobile, Mn e.g.
the study acknowledges dicots usually dont accumulate it but that's why they tested these other products (chelating agents etc) if then, it still can help.
the waterglass pot sil fared best, some agents even hurt the plant.
older plant material had always significantly higher concentrations of Si than new, it's because it's taken in rather slowly/steadily, can't go overboard with Si, but the K is there as well
Control plant got K Sulfate instead to make K levels even...
Silicon concentration [mg Si/g TS] "old leaves" "middle leaves" ab c control c Greemax KSi KSi+Greemax c Aerosil cc Aerosil+Greemax Fig. 4.3: Influence of Greemax, potash water glass (“KSi”) and Aerosilsoil application on the Si concentration in the “old” and “middle” leaves of vine cuttings of the Variety Bacchus after 47 days in the pot experiment (mean values n=5, different letters symbolize significant differences within a leaf fraction [Tukey test, p≤0.05]; error bars indicate the standard deviation from the mean) Greemax® caused compared to the "control" variant Significantly higher Mn concentration in the leaf tissue of the “medium leaf” fraction if it was not applied together with silicates (“KSi”, Aerosil®) (Fig. 4.4).
the KSi had best results, this was done in pot, 5*5 plants repeatedly.
IIRC the potass sil dissociates partially in water to form silicic acid.
the study says it has to be applied via the soil, otherwise (foliar) it will not make it inside the plant but instead form an outside layer which actually is also helpful vs pathogen infestation.
but it has many other positive functions esp. to help the plant shift nutrients around that are usually not very mobile, Mn e.g.
the study acknowledges dicots usually dont accumulate it but that's why they tested these other products (chelating agents etc) if then, it still can help.
the waterglass pot sil fared best, some agents even hurt the plant.
older plant material had always significantly higher concentrations of Si than new, it's because it's taken in rather slowly/steadily, can't go overboard with Si, but the K is there as well
Control plant got K Sulfate instead to make K levels even...
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mudballs
Well-Known Member
what am i talking to a wall? thank you for liking my earlier post f.r. but these plants don't "need" any. i understand people want the best, but these plants don't use this stuff to the degree it is "needed" or even wanted...they're non-accumulators.....even god said "no, these plants don't need it"
mudballs
Well-Known Member
She even friggin told you this stuff can hurt ur grows in excessive amounts...how many of you been dosing ur plants and hurting ur yields?
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