The Truth About Ron Paul - Part 2

MixedMelodyMindBender

Active Member
In my opinion they all seem to know how to say the right thing when needed but not many presidents have been able to do the right thing when needed. Politics is a game of talk. And we know many that talk but dont walk the talk :)

Perhaps someone should run on the notion of no promises or vow's. It would be an honest approach rather then just flabbin at the gum about im gonna do this and do that and when I get in office you can bet that I am ...zzzzzzzzzzzzz...... a no show...just like any other wad that walked in there and though they had the world and all its problems all figured out.
 

Dan Kone

Well-Known Member
Talk about stereotyping and lowering yourself Dan, you label me as a hater even though you seemingly purposefully ignore my clear recognition in my posts that I do not hate Americans or anyone else for that matter, if you were to go back and read every post you responded to me in this thread you will see that you were the one berating and belittling me not visa versa...."Mr. Douchebag"
I'm not sure you understand what the word "stereotyping" means. It doesn't mean to form an opinion about a person based on specific things they say or do. It's confusing when you say you don't hate Americans when most of your posts are full of negative stereotypes about Americans.

And you are right in saying that there will always be idiots in every country but are you choosing to ignore that the rest of the worlds understanding of a first world country like America who is the best at everything is that they would overall be more educated, aware and in tune with the rest of the world considering they are always delving into everyone's business and trying to tell them democracy and capitalism is the only way, the right way, Christ's way.
Democracy is the only way, the right way. Everyone in the world should have the right to determine who represents them in government. You act like people living under an oppressive dictator are just choosing some alternative lifestyle. It's not a choice. The people of Libya asked for our help in getting rid of their psychopathic leadership that was murdering their own people and we gave it to them. There is no American oppression there. We were invited in.

Your comment of *we are somewhat isolated over here* is most probably accurate from the point of view that Americans are fed a daily systematic diet of delusion they call their daily lives
This is the type of bullshit statement I've been talking about. Who the fuck are you to say shit like this just because people have a different idea of what is important?

3rd world countries expect you guys to know better and act accordingly, not to just run in and take what you want because you have bigger guns.
So you're blaming America for human nature? Interesting.

This is not the vast majority of the citizens of America's fault nor their personal actions but rather a secluded bunch of mavericks who abuse their power and position for their own gain.
We are for the most part aware of this. What appears to be ignorance on our part is apathy that stems from the fact there really isn't much we can do to change this.

Your other comment of *why the fuck should we care where they are?* can be interpreted in one of two ways, the location of places is not all that much of a big deal and in the scheme of thing it ain't pivotal to anyone's life necessarily BUT it could also be interpreted in a way in which I see many many westerners view the rest of the world...IF IT AIN'T HAPPENING TO ME THEN I DON'T CARE WHAT HAPPENS TO THEM, RATHER THEM THAN ME ATTITUDE which is precisely the problem I have with western society.
Then I think you're misunderstanding us. It's more like "why should I waste energy caring about something I have no power what so ever to change?". I think people here would care if they thought there was something they could do about it.

Obama was elected precisely because Americans were tired of a lot of things you are complaining about. His campaign was based on ending wars, stopping torture, and getting rid of the secret off shore prisons where people are locked up without trial. Look what that did? Business as usual.

There were thousands, maybe millions of us protesting the Iraq war. I was in San Francisco when it started and we shut down the city very successfully for quite a while. Our non-violent protests just got us police beatings.

So you're asking us to care about things we have no power to control. Americans for the most part are not in control of what the government does. We can vote for politicians that will make more subtle changes, but the driving forces behind US foreign policy are out of our control.

When was the last time America or any country in Europe was bombed to shit since WWII? It is easy to digress as a westerner isn't it. This is why governments are allowed to get away with what they do but it has become so complacent a problem that now westerners are even allowing themselves to be cornered into agreeing to stripping of liberties for the sake a false war on terror or any other implement that suits the few rather then the many.
I think you'll find there is bi-partisan popular support in America to end military involvement in the war on terror and just start arresting or killing individual terrorists rather than invade countries. But that doesn't mean shit to corporate lobbyists or politicians.

if you had you would realise that I am not a hater of American citizens but rather a hater of western complacency and overall ignorance of the truth behind what our governments in collusion with corporate powers to do us all, 1st world or the 3rd world.
Quit making broad and false generalizations about cultures you obviously have very little understanding for and then people won't get the impression that your bigoted against Americans.

By the way Dan, if you had ever interacted with a rural person in a 3rd world environment who is largely untouched by western ways you would realise that they have very little understanding of jealousy or bitterness which only goes to show that these emotions and feelings are created by western ways.
From my experience that is correct. But I'm not talking about all people from rural third world countries. I'm talking about you specifically.

PS. As much as you may hate to hear this you better enjoy that No.1 position whilst it lasts, every dog has it's day....you only have to look back in history for proof of that.
indeed.
 

MixedMelodyMindBender

Active Member
Nope. The constitution is represented by more than a politician. I am not saying he is a bad politician or whatever, but no ron paul is perhaps a Constitutionalist, not a representative of the constitution. More so, I reject the idea of Ron Paul representing the(will-interest) of the people. The people always represent the people. No different than a court of law. Besides, he's a congressman they do different things than those folks over at the House of Representatives...who perhaps may or are "supposed" to "represent" the people and their interest, but I say that very loosely, especially in today's world bongsmilie

Progress vs. Congress is a funny clause I learned today :) No wonder they can't get nothing done.

However, Mr. Paul gets a A+ on his ending prohibition activism. I support the movement to end this war against us likewise. I like him, but I question if he walks the talks. Anybody can talk a good game and say what people want to hear. It another to grab the balls come go time. Especially at his age :/

Great thread :eyesmoke:
 

budlover13

King Tut
Nope. The constitution is represented by more than a politician. I am not saying he is a bad politician or whatever, but no ron paul is perhaps a Constitutionalist, not a representative of the constitution. More so, I reject the idea of Ron Paul representing the(will-interest) of the people. The people always represent the people. No different than a court of law. Besides, he's a congressman they do different things than those folks over at the House of Representatives...who perhaps may or are "supposed" to "represent" the people and their interest, but I say that very loosely, especially in today's world bongsmilie

Progress vs. Congress is a funny clause I learned today :) No wonder they can't get nothing done.

However, Mr. Paul gets a A+ on his ending prohibition activism. I support the movement to end this war against us likewise. I like him, but I question if he walks the talks. Anybody can talk a good game and say what people want to hear. It another to grab the balls come go time. Especially at his age :/

Great thread :eyesmoke:
i didn't mean representing in that sense put rather trying to uphold the Constitution. Sorry:oops:
 

MixedMelodyMindBender

Active Member
"3rd world countries expect you guys to know better and act accordingly, not to just run in and take what you want because you have bigger guns."


"So you're blaming America for human nature? Interesting."

Considering America is the single most influential society in the last 200 year I would say no to human nature and yes to one fucked up society....and I mean grande fucked up. It's not human nature to drop bombs on a contrary as a sign of "hey we care" or "hey this should help the cause have some bombs"......Every one under the sun knows that America is a BULLY, and a BROKE one at that :)

Dan, we can all tell that you are a very passionate person in regards to America.. Americanism comes to mind....A patriot! And I say good for you, there is nothing wrong with that. Some believe its a false pride, and most of the world thinks its a special form of ignorance.

Democracy however, is not the only way. For if that was true we would be able to say that the ONLY civilization that has lasted and remained dominate in the world was a democratic society. THAT is NOT true, nor will it ever happen. EVERY GREAT CIVILIZATION know to mankind has CRUMBLED. FAILED, to rumble...and 9 times outta 10 it was to blame on a Government! Democracy is not a promise its an ideology and it is WRONG to force your IDEA's unto another....regardless of how RIGHTEOUS one make think it is :)

The Aztecs, The Mayans, The Romans, The Incas,The Egyptians....ALL GONE......Every last known great civilization has crumbled...and 2 of those practiced democracy.....SOOOO....It's not the only way...and its not the right way. Its wishful thinking, with good intentions at best. We as a species can not prove Democracy works any better than Dictatorship.

Oh yea......One more thing...When you tell someone to STOP or to QUIT doing something...Its not very democratic ...especially if you think its the only way....It reminds me of what politicians do now days....Preach the law while breaking it....

bongsmilie:eyesmoke::mrgreen:
 

newworldicon

Well-Known Member
I'm not sure you understand what the word "stereotyping" means. It doesn't mean to form an opinion about a person based on specific things they say or do. It's confusing when you say you don't hate Americans when most of your posts are full of negative stereotypes about Americans.



Democracy is the only way, the right way. Everyone in the world should have the right to determine who represents them in government. You act like people living under an oppressive dictator are just choosing some alternative lifestyle. It's not a choice. The people of Libya asked for our help in getting rid of their psychopathic leadership that was murdering their own people and we gave it to them. There is no American oppression there. We were invited in.



This is the type of bullshit statement I've been talking about. Who the fuck are you to say shit like this just because people have a different idea of what is important?



So you're blaming America for human nature? Interesting.



We are for the most part aware of this. What appears to be ignorance on our part is apathy that stems from the fact there really isn't much we can do to change this.



Then I think you're misunderstanding us. It's more like "why should I waste energy caring about something I have no power what so ever to change?". I think people here would care if they thought there was something they could do about it.

Obama was elected precisely because Americans were tired of a lot of things you are complaining about. His campaign was based on ending wars, stopping torture, and getting rid of the secret off shore prisons where people are locked up without trial. Look what that did? Business as usual.

There were thousands, maybe millions of us protesting the Iraq war. I was in San Francisco when it started and we shut down the city very successfully for quite a while. Our non-violent protests just got us police beatings.

So you're asking us to care about things we have no power to control. Americans for the most part are not in control of what the government does. We can vote for politicians that will make more subtle changes, but the driving forces behind US foreign policy are out of our control.



I think you'll find there is bi-partisan popular support in America to end military involvement in the war on terror and just start arresting or killing individual terrorists rather than invade countries. But that doesn't mean shit to corporate lobbyists or politicians.



Quit making broad and false generalizations about cultures you obviously have very little understanding for and then people won't get the impression that your bigoted against Americans.



From my experience that is correct. But I'm not talking about all people from rural third world countries. I'm talking about you specifically.



indeed.
I was just today thinking that many people all be it aware of what is going on around them still feel exactly what you said, helpless and unable to even start where to change things.

So I am jaded and bitter?? that's interesting...now you can some me up with your superior intelligence.

PS. The Libyan people never asked for American or NATO help, that is a fact!!!!
 

Dan Kone

Well-Known Member
Democracy however, is not the only way. For if that was true we would be able to say that the ONLY civilization that has lasted and remained dominate in the world was a democratic society
To be clear, when I say democracy, what I'm referring to is a government system where the people choose the leadership. Not necessarily direct democracy, not even capitalism. If people want to vote for communists to lead their countries, that is their choice and it's not our place to tell them otherwise.

The key to that is that it's their choice and if they don't like it they have the option to change it to better reflect the needs of the people.

What is really not up for debate is that people are universally better off with elected leadership. The accountability that comes with democratic elections is in fact the superior to all other forms of government when it comes to government representing the will of the people over a long period of time.

Sure, you can have a benevolent dictator, but you're unlikely to get a succession of 10 of them in a row. One bad one can damage a country irreparably. It only takes one Commodus to undo every good thing that comes from good dictators like Marcus Aurelius, Trajan, and Caesar Augusta. If you have a bad president, you can elect a new one when his term is up. If you have a bad dictator, it takes a civil war to even have a chance at replacing him.

Basically, for all it's flaws and examples of failure, democratic elections aren't just one of many ways to run a country. They are in fact the best way and should be the only way. Anything else is denying people their collective right to self determination.
 

Johnnyorganic

Well-Known Member
A group of US representatives plan to introduce legislation that will legalize marijuana and allow states to legislate its use, pro-marijuana groups said Wednesday.

The legislation would limit the federal government's role in marijuana enforcement to cross-border or inter-state smuggling, and allow people to legally grow, use or sell marijuana in states where it is legal.

The bill, which is expected to be introduced on Thursday by Republican Representative Ron Paul and Democratic Representative Barney Frank, would be the first ever legislation designed to end the federal ban on marijuana.

Sixteen of the 50 states as well as the District of Columbia have legalized the use of marijuana for medical purposes.

But planting, selling or commercially distributing marijuana remains illegal under federal law.

Last year, California citizens voted not to legalize recreational marijuana use, although the debate continues in about half a dozen other states.

Three weeks ago a group of ex-presidents of Latin America as well as former United Nations Secretary General Kofi Annan denounced the failure of the global war on drugs and called for urgent changes, including the legalization of cannabis.

Between 1998 and 2008, worldwide consumption of opiates increased 35 percent, with cocaine use growing 27 percent and marijuana use growing 8.5 percent, according to the Global Commission on Drug Policy.

June marks the 40th anniversary of the "War on Drugs" launched by President Richard Nixon in 1970, the first major US anti-drug initiative.
http://ca.news.yahoo.com/lawmakers-introduce-bill-legalize-marijuana-225335489.html
 

Johnnyorganic

Well-Known Member
Ron Paul just put out a bill today to decrim marijuana on the national level
You would not happen to have that HR # would you because that would be very interesting...

As Ron Paul has been steadfastly in favor of re-legalization.

In fact, he will file a bill tomorrow for the purpose of re-legalizing cannabis.

Decriminalization would be a step back from that.
 

MixedMelodyMindBender

Active Member
"PS. The Libyan people never asked for American or NATO help, that is a fact!!!! "

The whole world knows we do what we want and we always have as a country. Straight back to the Native Americans and Columbus until Present we as a nation have never respected anything sovereign and that is something I absolutely agree with Mr. Paul on!
We as a nation need to change this epidemic because it presents us as an always hostile nation....which provokes lunatics and other beasts.

Why should'nt Libya perhaps come offer their help and services and see how WE like it? Seems fair in a "democratic" country.

The idea of you leave us alone and we leave you alone works but we have ego's and pride and all sorts of other lovely shit to cause chaos bongsmilie

+Rep for the fact :blsmoke:
 

Johnnyorganic

Well-Known Member
sure, mistake I use the word decrim, I dont think there will be an HR # till thursday when its submited
I am aware of the fact that a resolution number will not be available for the re-legalization bill until it is filed tomorrow.

That is NOT the one I was asking you to provide.

I asked for the number of the HR you stated was filed (put out) TODAY, which I understood you to mean a decriminalization bill.
 

MixedMelodyMindBender

Active Member
To be clear, when I say democracy, what I'm referring to is a government system where the people choose the leadership. Not necessarily direct democracy, not even capitalism. If people want to vote for communists to lead their countries, that is their choice and it's not our place to tell them otherwise.

The key to that is that it's their choice and if they don't like it they have the option to change it to better reflect the needs of the people.

What is really not up for debate is that people are universally better off with elected leadership. The accountability that comes with democratic elections is in fact the superior to all other forms of government when it comes to government representing the will of the people over a long period of time.

Sure, you can have a benevolent dictator, but you're unlikely to get a succession of 10 of them in a row. One bad one can damage a country irreparably. It only takes one Commodus to undo every good thing that comes from good dictators like Marcus Aurelius, Trajan, and Caesar Augusta. If you have a bad president, you can elect a new one when his term is up. If you have a bad dictator, it takes a civil war to even have a chance at replacing him.

Basically, for all it's flaws and examples of failure, democratic elections aren't just one of many ways to run a country. They are in fact the best way and should be the only way. Anything else is denying people their collective right to self determination.
Perhaps if you were to medicate a little deeper you would be able to ease your trouble mind :) You have issues and should be checked by a trained professional as soon as possible.

I don't wish to entertain your whatever because your just "basically" shot. Predicting the future ? Know all about dictatorship and envisioning a democracy with this stipulation and that stipulation but not this one....I dont believe that is what the Founding Fathers had in Mind at all. Have a good one Tiger bongsmilie

+Rep for the Dictatorship Envisionment
 

deprave

New Member
I am aware of the fact that a resolution number will not be available for the re-legalization bill until it is filed tomorrow.

That is NOT the one I was asking you to provide.

I asked for the number of the HR you stated was filed (put out) TODAY, which I understood you to mean a decriminalization bill.
nother typo, I was talking about Thursdays legalization bill, sorry
 

MixedMelodyMindBender

Active Member
Anyone ever see the political cartoon that goes something along the lines of " Enter Slogan"- This years political candidate 2012. I think this sums up the truth about the people we put on pedestals in this country! It's shallow and a big cloud of smoke! Think for yourself, do for yourself and quit letting others fuck everything up for you and me!

bongsmilie:mrgreen: Smoke- Be Happy-Live Life
 

UncleBuck

Well-Known Member
...quit letting others fuck everything up for you and me!
i don't know about you, but i happen to be in charge of my own fate.

i don't bandy about pretending that my fate is in the hands of some politician or the other. i don't blame them when i fail, and they don't get credit when i succeed.

if some politician is your convenient place of blame for whatever issues you may have, then you have my full sympathy.
 

Dan Kone

Well-Known Member
Perhaps if you were to medicate a little deeper you would be able to ease your trouble mind :) You have issues and should be checked by a trained professional as soon as possible.

I don't wish to entertain your whatever because your just "basically" shot. Predicting the future ? Know all about dictatorship and envisioning a democracy with this stipulation and that stipulation but not this one....I dont believe that is what the Founding Fathers had in Mind at all. Have a good one Tiger bongsmilie

+Rep for the Dictatorship Envisionment
When telling people to seek help, you probably shouldn't follow it up with incoherent meaningless babbling.
 

Dan Kone

Well-Known Member
[video=youtube;M9rcGWiZK7k]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M9rcGWiZK7k[/video]

This guy is really impressive. IMO he could beat Obama in a general election if unemployment stays high.
 
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