The Truth About Ron Paul - Part 2

budlover13 said:

Ron Paul wants to follow the Constitution. Show me anything in that document that would be read as white rights only. i don't know it verbatim since i took the test in 8th grade, 23 years ago. Is there anything that would deny equal rights to all? i don't think so. Ron Paul would enforce what is in the Constitution. The Constitution didn't create salvery or racism. Men did that.

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RON PAUL: "The chances of us getting things changed around soon through the legislative process is not all the good. And that is why I am a strong endorser of the nullification movement, that states like this should just nullify these laws. And in principle, nullification is proper and moral and constitutional, which I believe it is"....

Despite Paul’s claim that nullification is proper and constitutional, Article 6 of the Constitution states This Constitution, and the Laws of the United States which shall be made in Pursuance thereof; and all Treaties made, or which shall be made, under the Authority of the United States, shall be the supreme Law of the Land; and the Judges in every State shall be bound thereby, any Thing in the Constitution or Laws of any State to the Contrary notwithstanding...

SO how can you say that he goes by the constitution when he goes against it by telling states they are free to ignore federal laws and directives

I still have not seem your examples LOndon.... YOU can't give hypothetical. YOu don't have a constitutional right to not have your feelings hurt. Being a bigot doesn't violate anyones liberties and to claim so is bizarre. There has to be an actual action not thoughts or words. YOu are not protected from words or feelings. Some people don't understand basic Constitutional law. I don't know of any Federal law that deals with verbal abuse either. LOL. This is getting pretty silly

UncleBuck said:

the jews had something like this going called "shtetls".

it made them sitting ducks comes WWII. the nazis were more easily able to wipe them out.

basically, the suggestion from carthosis is "go segregate yourself". his rights to treat them as inferior citizens reigns supreme.

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More or less. I wouldn't live in the middle of a group of people who hated me. What sense is there in that? Keep in mind that the US government was still giving out free land in those days and they could of went and homesteaded somewhere. They were giving away land until the 80s in the USA. The act pointedly said freed slaves were eligible. Instead, they continued to let the same people oppress them that always had. Wouldn't that be freedom? Your own land and no one bothering you? Freedom has nothing to do with your right to buy something at someones store. Freedom is about your right to do what you want without harming others. Freedom is doing what you want with your sweat, toil, and blood. Freedom is not forcing someone to sell you something.

Also, did you essentially say that a reason for blacks not starting a community somewhere is because we would round them all up and murder them like the Nazis? Jesus Christ - Seriously? Weren't you guys the ones who were just mocking me in this same thread for comparing what our government is doing to how Nazi Germany started? If you really seriously consider the government could potentially do this - how can you support giving more power to it?

londonfog said:

RON PAUL: "The chances of us getting things changed around soon through the legislative process is not all the good. And that is why I am a strong endorser of the nullification movement, that states like this should just nullify these laws. And in principle, nullification is proper and moral and constitutional, which I believe it is"....

Despite Paul’s claim that nullification is proper and constitutional, Article 6 of the Constitution states This Constitution, and the Laws of the United States which shall be made in Pursuance thereof; and all Treaties made, or which shall be made, under the Authority of the United States, shall be the supreme Law of the Land; and the Judges in every State shall be bound thereby, any Thing in the Constitution or Laws of any State to the Contrary notwithstanding...

SO how can you say that he goes by the constitution when he goes against it by telling states they are free to ignore federal laws and directives

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These are two different issues. The States have all the right and one of them being nullification.

Windsblow said:

I don't know what your talking about with Ron PAul you are talking about 2 different constitutional issues but I would agree that courts are often wrong and have been know to have illegal rulings.

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ummm I think our conversation has come to a close..we just don't agree....that comment was for budlover13 who I also quoted before I made my rebuttal..

londonfog said:

Carthoris speaks like a bigot....Hopefully his kind will die off and fade away soon, so this country can get to the place where we all treat others with kindness and respect...People are not born racist or a bigot that shit is taught, so we really have to blame his parents, but its up to the person to stop the "passing down" to the next generation...

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The issue of racism isn't a white one. It is all people. Every continent, every country, every state, every community. Blacks have an equal part in the continued racism in this country. If you don't understand that you might consider listening to Martin Luther King or even Bill Cosby. You are what you make of yourself. If you teach your children that there are hands holding them down, then they will not believe they can stand, whether there is a hand there or not.

londonfog said:

if a bigot was allowed to say and do what you think they should have a right to do, you would be surprise at would and could happen...so I think I showed how a bigot could be harmful and violate someones space and rights

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Please cite the specific rights your example trod upon.

Windsblow said:

These are two different issues. The States have all the right and one of them being nullification.

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guy have you really even read the constitution...You would be surprise at how many talk of it but failed to have read it...Do you even know what the Supremacy Clause is...I guess not for if you did you would have not typed what you just did...Federal Law trumps State Law...go read

londonfog said:

OK well let us look at some votes here from Ron Paul and his fight against racism. bigotry and hate..

HR1913- Hate Crimes Expansion- Expands definition of a hate crime to include felonies motivated by prejudice based on national origin, sexual orientation, or gender identity of the victim ...and RON PAUL'S vote NO ( bill still passed house)

HR2831-Equal Pay Bill-Vote to pass a bill that would designate that unequal payment based on race, religion, sex, national origin, age or disability is a new violation with each payment...and Ron Paul's vote NO ( bill still passed house)

HR11-Employment Discrimination Law Amendments-Issues grant money for salary negotiation skills training for girls and women,Increases penalties against a discriminatory employer including compensation of legal fees and liability for punitive damages against an employee...and Ron Paul's vote NO ( bill still passed house)

dude I could go on and on but you need to check for your self his voting record on civil issues before you claim how much he fights for it...show me just how he fights..his vote does not..

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HR1913 - why you commit murder, rape, or a beating is entirely beside the point. Why would you treat one person who does one of these acts out of hatred of race, religion, sex, or sexual preference differently than someone who does it out of hatred of another kind? The very nature of this law is racist. Isn't it already illegal to kill black gay transsexuals? Ron Paul voted no because all of the things this act covered were already illegal. I thought you were against segregation? Separate but unequal law. Next up, we have a bill going through congress that makes it illegal to steal purple cars!

HR2831 - This act was really just the right to sue for further back if you feel you were discriminated against. Most big companies have structures for pay. Most smaller companies that don't make offers which you choose to accept or not. Very high power jobs are wildly different from one person to the other depending on experience and the person. Discrimination is already illegal under other laws - what would this law have accomplished on top of them?

HR11 - Other than it being kind of pointless - Why would use federal money to train people to negotiate their salaries? Isn't that there own problem? Maybe the government should give me a thousand dollars so I can negotiate a better price on my vehicle when I buy a new one.

None of these are civil rights issues as much as they are a huge waste of time. They don't add anything useful to the government and it isn't the Federal Governments job to address these issues to begin with. I bet Ron Paul had a big throbbing vein in his forehead when they said the Federal Government should train women/girls to negotiate pay better. Whether the victim is gay, straight, man, woman, black, or white - the crime is the same. Getting murdered makes you dead, getting raped makes you raped, getting beat gets you beat. If I beat a black man and a white man - do they feel different pain?

Funny thing about the Constitution, it gives powers over all trials to Juries, not laws and not judges or the Constitution. Article 3, section 2..... "The Trial of all Crimes, except in Cases of Impeachment, shall be by Jury; and such Trial shall be held in the State where the said Crimes shall have been committed..."

I see everyone thinks that being a bigot does not hurt others...


Bardwell, a Tangipahoa Parish Louisiana Judge (outside New Orleans), became famous for rejecting Terence McKay and his girlfriend Beth Humphrey, who wanted to be married by Bardwell. But Keith decided to show the country what a real bigot was when he said "I do it to protect the children, he reportedly said. The kids are innocent and I worry about their futures" when asked why he would not marry an interracial couple.
According to the Associated Press, Bardwell said this:
.....Do you think this judge truly gave out fair sentencings on the bench.

londonfog said:

Far from it ....most white people are very kind and giving...but a few still cling to that "Southern Heritage"..that "white pride"...hell did you not pay attention to some of these clowns when Obama was elected..Those pieces of racist bigoted waste are the ones I'm speaking to and about...and I bet if some are allowed to tell someone that they can't come in to shop in the store they would...are you saying that no one would do that ???

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I bet you smile and feel warm inside when you hear people talk about black power, the strength of the African race, or the great cultural identity that the black community has. Have you ever considered that maybe that is what people who talk about southern pride or white pride are feeling? I know when I hear about my ancestors in the country of my origin fighting the oppressive British empire I feel a tingling in my chest. My family came to America as prisoners of a rebellion - their land stolen, taken from their families and cultures, shackled and sent to a new world. Why should that be different for anyone knows that in their blood runs the warrior, poet, and patriot of their blood line? How could direct descendents of George Washington, Martin Luther King, or any of the great men in history not feel some awe of their own potential? When a black man thinks of Martin Luther King he thinks of the hopes, dreams, and greatness that are in him potentially whether he is related or not - why would it be different for the white man? Why are you so racist, London, that you cannot accept for a moment that someone else's love or feelings for their own people doesn't necessarily mean hatred for another? Don't mistake pride for racism.

As far as how people acted when Obama was elected, look at how both sides acted. You had people who had never voted and were in their 50's, who didn't even understand any of the politics involved voting for Obama because he was black. How can you not feel that is wrong? I didn't see a bunch of white people voting for McCain just because Obama was black. There are always squawkers in the world - stop acting like a huge portion of the country is racist.

londonfog said:

I see everyone thinks that being a bigot does not hurt others...


Bardwell, a Tangipahoa Parish Louisiana Judge (outside New Orleans), became famous for rejecting Terence McKay and his girlfriend Beth Humphrey, who wanted to be married by Bardwell. But Keith decided to show the country what real bigot was when he said "I do it to protect the children, he reportedly said. The kids are innocent and I worry about their futures" when asked why he would not marry an interracial couple.
According to the Associated Press, Bardwell said this:

"I'm not a racist. I just don't believe in mixing the races that way," Bardwell told the Associated Press on Thursday. "I have piles and piles of black friends. They come to my home, I marry them, they use my bathroom. I treat them just like everyone else."​

.....Do you think this judge truly gave out fair sentencings on the bench.

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No, that is what the appeals court is for. Our constitution protects the right to a fair trial.

I fail to see what your point is. My opinion that welfare should be completely abolished would hurt somebody, I'm most assured. Does that mean they have the right to make my opinion illegal?

You do realize that those people just went to one of the other justices and got married, right? No one was hurt. the Judge wasn't "Sentencing" anyone, he just refused to marry the couple. Of course the couple could have just PAID for a minister and gotten married too.

UncleBuck said:

[video=youtube;bXmrOt9LVm8]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bXmrOt9LVm8[/video]

is that you, newt?

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Not even close to the same thing and you know it. The good news is no one takes you seriously already, so you can't sink any lower. I can explain my opinions, back them up with rational thoughts and facts - and I do because I realize you don't understand the basics of freedom and reality.

londonfog said:

again you think God gives you rights...I don't....nothing to not understand there....Tell me what rights God gave you...

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The proper terminology would be 'natural rights' but it means the same thing and you know it. Stop playing word games because you don't have an argument.

budlover13 said:

Sorry, not mis-spoke. Taken out of context sir. BTW, read your post above and then my post below.

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I think anyone reading the full quote of what I said understands what I was saying and that it was not racist in any way. The only reason thing 1 and thing 2 accuse me of racism or trying to say that was my intention is because they are stirring the pot.

londonfog said:

ok seems like you know what he was trying to say so you explain it...
Blacks could of went and bought land somewhere and started their own city that didn't outlaw blacks in the front of the bus, or gave them a better selection of shopping. As a person you don't have an obligation to other people to treat them all the same. The government does have that obligation, but the people do not. Thus the difference between a public business(A government owned/run business) vs a private business(An individually owned business)
Tell me how this was taken out of context when this country back then was the way it was...??? and as a person I treat all the same until they show me why I SHOULD NOT...but I guess your gods who give you guys rights teaches you something different...

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I treat everyone the same, though I don't have to by any stretch of the imagination. Also, in that same paragraph, I pointed out that the government had a duty to treat all of the citizens equally. Laws should not involve race, religion, sex, color, age, or any other category. If it is illegal to do something to a black person it must be illegal to do it to a white person or it is a simple case of discrimination. If this concept is way above your head, then I am very sorry for you and the upbringing that made you incapable of understanding this.

Laws have to be made if ignorant people refuse to do whats right...If Walmart only decided to hire asians you would be fired..so thank laws for protecting your rights

UncleBuck said:

not if it is 'open to the public'.

because you would be impinging on the rights of others, as it does harm to those you discriminate against on the basis of your bigotry. empirical evidence proves this.

your right to be bigoted is overtaken by the rights of the public not to be harmed by your bigotry.

you do not have the right to harm others with your bigotry. feel free to be as bigoted as you wish on your own time as long as it does not harm others.

no one can stop you from being a bigot.

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Obviously you are still unable to see the different between hurting and not helping. If you break your foot when you wreck your skateboard but I ignore you and walk by - I am not hurting you. I am just not helping you. If you come into my store to buy something and I won't sell it to you - I am not hurting you - you are the same as you were when you got there. I am just not helping you.