War

Roger A. Shrubber said:

I'm not saying i don't agree with you, but the minute NATO gets more involved than having trainers in Ukraine, Then russia can and probably will use that as an excuse to escalate the situation, and it seem like they only have one path of escalation left....
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I believe otherwise. I think Russia would use battlefield nukes if they have an indication that their use would lead to a better bottom line.

Nato has been consistent in telling the Russians that they’ll see to it that that does not happen. I can only speculate as to how.

But despite all the hollow talk, I think Russian command is very loath to risk a nuclear exchange. We have fewer weapons than before, and some interesting antiballistic tech on the horizon. Even so, the “nobody wins” calculus is set in stone for now.

Fogdog said:

I've done a search on this topic and the only reference to this is that Times report. I also found this:

IAEA inspectors find explosives at Russia-occupied ZNPP

International Atomic Energy Agency (IAEA) observers have found explosives in the main turbine hall of Russia-occupied Zaporizhzhya Nuclear Power Plant (ZNPP), agency representatives told Ukraine’s State Nuclear Regulatory Inspectorate (SNRI) on May 3.

www.yahoo.com

They are using the nuclear plant to store not just explosives but military equipment and arms. The inspectors did not report that the plant had been "wired" with explosives. I don't know if the Times report is accurate or not. If it were true, don't you think the story would also be carried on major news outlets?

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I'm going by the times report that I posted and that is what is up for discussion, the implications of such an act. They are evacuating people from the area and the report said they were wiring the place up to go bang. I and others suspect they will do something profoundly stupid as a distraction, or maybe force NATO to act so they can withdraw saving face, it is hoped. A worst-case scenario would see them blow up the reactors or cooling water supply system for the entire facility. My concern is how to stop this by any means necessary and I would not be the one calling the shots either or approving of the actions. I'm sure Ukrainian and American intelligence know what is going on there, we will soon see because the Ukrainian offensive is about to begin, and that power plant is on their priority list, not to attack, but to surround and isolate.

Roger A. Shrubber said:

I'm not saying i don't agree with you, but the minute NATO gets more involved than having trainers in Ukraine, Then russia can and probably will use that as an excuse to escalate the situation, and it seem like they only have one path of escalation left....
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They could take it as a face-saving move and have the excuse that they are now up against NATO and for the peace of the world they will graciously depart. At least that is my hope, assuming they really are wiring up the power plant for a meltdown. Ukraine will not attack it, but they will cut it off and surround the Russians there, unless they leave first. If they are stuck there surrounded, then they are less likely to commit nuclear suicide and they could have trouble getting out with Ukrainian special forces blocking the exits. That power plant is huge and has many reactors.

cannabineer said:

I believe otherwise. I think Russia would use battlefield nukes if they have an indication that their use would lead to a better bottom line.

Nato has been consistent in telling the Russians that they’ll see to it that that does not happen. I can only speculate as to how.

But despite all the hollow talk, I think Russian command is very loath to risk a nuclear exchange. We have fewer weapons than before, and some interesting antiballistic tech on the horizon. Even so, the “nobody wins” calculus is set in stone for now.

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Nothing said about plans to create a nuclear catastrophe in this post. But there are risks and people are aware of them. In any case, even if the evacuations cause a disaster at the plant due to a lapse in staffing, it's not going to explode on its own. It would be a disaster for Ukraine to be sure. They need that plant to meet their electricity needs.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2023/05/08/zaporizhzhia-nuclear-plant-evacuation-ukraine/

Russia preparing to evacuate nuclear plant, Ukrainian operator says
By Siobhán O'Grady
and
Kostiantyn Khudov
May 8, 2023 at 2:04 p.m. ED

KYIV, Ukraine — Russian authorities controlling the Zaporizhzhia nuclear power plant in southern Ukraine are preparing to evacuate about 3,100 staff from areas in and around the facility, the head of Ukraine’s nuclear operator said Monday.

The plant pullout is being planned as occupying Russian authorities evacuate civilians from communities around the facility, the largest of its kind in Europe, in advance of a potential Ukrainian offensive in the south, Energoatom President Petro Kotin told The Washington Post.

The Russian-appointed governor of occupied Zaporizhzhia said Sunday that about 1,600 civilians had been moved out Enerhodar, home to the plant and many of its employees, and other communities. He cited “intensified shelling” by Ukrainian forces.

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Ukraine has been planning for months to launch a large-scale counteroffensive aimed at retaking territory under Russian control. Analysts believe the nuclear plant, a major source of electricity and income for Ukraine, will be a top priority.

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A Ukrainian employee of the plant said evacuation buses are seen daily, but that “who exactly is traveling is not visible” because the windows are covered with curtains.

The employee spoke on the condition of anonymity because of security concerns.

“Ukrainian personnel are not going to evacuate,” the employee said. Those employed by Rosatom are next due to report to work after May 10, the day after Russia’s Victory Day celebrations to commemorate the end of World War II. “Then we’ll see,” the employee said.
The evacuations, Kotin said, are a sign that Russian forces are “scared and trying to be ready to get out of there.”

As far as I understand it Russia is storing explosives there, not wiring them up to blow.

Need to retrofit a few Ukrainian fighters with F16 radar and a few missiles.

Belarusian battalion recaptures trenches from Russians on Donbas 'road of life'
"To reach the enemy's dugout, destroy the personnel, occupy and gain a foothold on a strategically important line,” the unit recounted their orders.

“The task is completed.”

The “road of life” is believed to be the only semi-passable road still left in the area, and is considered critical for resupply and troop movements. It remains under threat from Russian assaults and artillery.

The U.S. estimates that 20,000 Russian troops have been killed in the last five months of fighting for Bakhmut.

Don't kid yerself, liberal democracies can be nasty and ethnic Russians are perceived as a threat, however picking on the elderly is counterproductive IMHO and unnecessarily cruel. Old people are not much of a threat to anybody, but the younger they are the more they should be expected to adapt, since ethnic Russians living in a place are seen as an excuse to invaded it by Russia and many do have an attitude. If they didn't make Russia such a Hellhole, perhaps they would not mind living there as much or fear being deported back there.

Looks like America could nuke Russia with a first strike and if they cause a meltdown in Ukraine.


PUTIN IS FREAKING OUT - RUSSIAN MILITARY STOLE COMPONENTS FOR EARLY WARNING RADARS || 2023

Could this be why Vlad was wiring up the reactors in Ukraine, or it looked like he was? You rain on my big parade, and I will blow up your reactors?

DIY-HP-LED said:

Could this be why Vlad was wiring up the reactors in Ukraine, or it looked like he was? You rain on my big parade, and I will blow up your reactors?

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1655865740258320387

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i found some more footage of the parade through your link...

DIY-HP-LED said:

Looks like America could nuke Russia with a first strike and if they cause a meltdown in Ukraine.

PUTIN IS FREAKING OUT - RUSSIAN MILITARY STOLE COMPONENTS FOR EARLY WARNING RADARS || 2023

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technically it would not be a first nuclear strike.

cannabineer said:

technically it would not be a first nuclear strike.

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I don't know, can you call sabotaging a major nuclear facility a "first strike" ?
first strike seems to suggest tactical planning and deployment...what the russians are doing is just what they always do, neglecting things until they become unignorable issues. Tactical sloth and stupidity?...The deployment of vodka bottles and potato soup?

cannabineer said:

technically it would not be a first nuclear strike.

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If they were facing as malicious an adversary as they are themselves, they would be fucked. I'm sure Uncle Sam knows much more about this and in a lot of detail!

Putin warned about the threat from the West
The West aims to destroy Russia. This was stated by Russian President Vladimir Putin during a speech at the Victory Day parade on Red Square.

“The West talks about its exclusivity, provokes conflicts, sows hatred, destroys family values in order to continue to impose its will on peoples. The goal of the opponents of Russia, and there is nothing new here, is to achieve the disintegration and destruction of our country,” Vladimir Putin said. URA.RU broadcasts live from the parade in Moscow

What Putin said at the Victory Parade in Moscow: the main statements of the President on May 9
Russian President Vladimir Putin delivered a festive speech at the Victory Day parade on Red Square. URA.RU gives the main theses of the President of the Russian Federation.

• Civilization is at a turning point, a real war has been unleashed against the Motherland . However, the country will defeat terrorism.
• There are no unfriendly countries for Russia . The country wants to see its future peaceful, free and stable. Russia should use the experience of cooperation and solidarity to build a multipolar world, for which there is now a demand.
• Any ideology that promotes superiority is criminal. However, Western countries continue to talk about their exclusivity. They spread theses that are directed against humanity.
• Western countries have forgotten who defeated the Nazis. Who did not spare their lives for the sake of the freedom of Europe.
• Demolition of monuments to Soviet soldiers is a crime. The West wants to cross out the results of the Second World War.
• The people of Ukraine are hostages of a coup d'état. Kiev is ruled by the West .
• Russia is proud of the participants in the special military operation . The fighters of the NMD honorably fulfill their military duty, fighting for the Russian Federation.
• The West aims to destroy Russia. The goal of the opponents of Russia is to achieve the disintegration and destruction of our country.

Roger A. Shrubber said:

I don't know, can you call sabotaging a major nuclear facility a "first strike" ?
first strike seems to suggest tactical planning and deployment...what the russians are doing is just what they always do, neglecting things until they become unignorable issues. Tactical sloth and stupidity?...The deployment of vodka bottles and potato soup?

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it’s a deliberate and hostile nuclear release in the prosecution of a war. A bit like that “dirty bomb” fantasy someone has suggested the Ukrainians commit.

So yeah, I would classify it as an act of nuclear war. Not sure if the pros would agree.

cannabineer said:

it’s a deliberate and hostile nuclear release in the prosecution of a war. A bit like that “dirty bomb” fantasy someone has suggested the Ukrainians commit.

So yeah, I would classify it as an act of nuclear war. Not sure if the pros would agree.

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The Russians are only using it as a shield, they are not planing on blowing it up.